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Old 25-03-2009, 21:05:29   #1
Lazarus and the Gimp
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Was Britpop all shit?

I was trying to think of the good stuff that came out of Britop. And I couldn't. It really was an awful time.
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Old 25-03-2009, 21:39:27   #2
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blur did a couple of good songs, oasis had some absolute smashers, although you kind of forget that because they are twats. radiohead were the best of the bunch. i quite liked kulashaker.
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Old 25-03-2009, 21:47:40   #3
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I've never heard an Oasis song that I liked. Radiohead are too prog to fit the bill (and I'm no fan anyway).

Anyone find themselves humming hits by Echobelly or Gene lately? Thought not.
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Old 25-03-2009, 23:12:53   #4
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Does Pulp count? I quite like some of their material.
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Old 26-03-2009, 02:54:37   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp
I've never heard an Oasis song that I liked. Radiohead are too prog to fit the bill (and I'm no fan anyway).

Anyone find themselves humming hits by Echobelly or Gene lately? Thought not.
there can be a difference between whether you like something and whether you recognise that a song is good.

but if you don't like radiohead there's something wrong with your brain.
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Old 26-03-2009, 06:17:14   #6
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Oh, there's a couple of decent songs on "The Bends", but I thought "OK Computer" was a joke. The sound of a band determinedly heading up its own bum.
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Old 26-03-2009, 09:58:45   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp
I was trying to think of the good stuff that came out of Britop. And I couldn't. It really was an awful time.
Agreed.

I did like the first Oasis album when it came out, but I can't imagine putting it on to listen to now. The new stuff I was listening to then was mainly dance (most of which was mainly drug induced and actually terrible) and hip-hop.

Stuff from pre and post britpop era I listen to all the time, of my brit-pop albums... nothing really.
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Old 26-03-2009, 12:02:59   #8
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Elastica had loads of good songs on their first record, Parklife is full of amazing amazing songs, Pulp made at least 3 excellent albums, every record Supergrass have released is great, and Oasis still have their moments.

The problem with Britpop wasn't really the big bands, it was more the glut of generic Camden shit that came in its wake, that whole jaunty, strings and (worse) horns on everything sound. And Ocean Colour Scene.
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Old 26-03-2009, 12:15:05   #9
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Does Supergrass count as britpop? I would never have put them in that boat, but if so they are still great.
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Old 26-03-2009, 12:17:03   #10
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I don't own ANY britpop albums, and I am pleased about that.

I think even my sister recognises the shiteness of it and she had loads of britpop music.
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Old 26-03-2009, 13:27:15   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Funko
Does Supergrass count as britpop? I would never have put them in that boat, but if so they are still great.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britpop

Quote:
At the start of 1995 Britpop bands including Sleeper, Supergrass, and Menswear scored pop hits
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Britpop_musicians

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supergrass

Of that all, I only think I ever heard 2 or 3 songs by Oasis which I forgot, and one by Blur which I liked and still sometimes hum
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Old 26-03-2009, 13:30:49   #12
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urgh I was trying to forget about Divine comedy, boo radleys and dodgy. Particularly dodgy.
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Old 26-03-2009, 13:35:30   #13
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wow

you also had:

Britpop related bands
Britpop second wave

what else?
Teh Return of the Britpop
Britpop Strikes Back
Britpop: attack of teh clones
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Old 26-03-2009, 16:28:51   #14
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Britpop and the raiders of the lost album?
Britpop and the turntable of doom?
Britpop and the last CD?

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Old 26-03-2009, 16:38:07   #15
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Well, honestly, the genre as an idea is fairly awful, and some of the individual bands involved are my absolutely least favourite of all time (ESPECIALLY Blur and Radiohead, no mitigating songs for either). But I don't mind some of the Oasis stuff, and Pulp if Jarvis Cocker wasn't fronting would be largely excellent.
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Old 26-03-2009, 16:48:08   #16
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Originally posted by Debaser
Elastica had loads of good songs on their first record

When they stopped plagiarising Wire they revealed themselves to be rather uninspired.
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Old 26-03-2009, 16:49:33   #17
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Oh fuck. I'd forgotten about Cast. They were waaay beyond bad.
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Old 26-03-2009, 16:59:09   #18
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people who say they don't like radiohead are lying.
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Old 26-03-2009, 17:05:31   #19
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Every single person who likes Radiohead is a complete whining twat. They're worse than all of the emo bands combined, sickeningly egocentric me-music for spoilt upper-middle-class teenagers who think they're the most interesting people in the world.
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Old 26-03-2009, 17:07:43   #20
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And that goes for both the early "tosser" period, and the later "wanker" period.
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Old 26-03-2009, 17:08:49   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Pulp if Jarvis Cocker wasn't fronting would be largely excellent.
that is the opposite of the truth.
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Old 26-03-2009, 17:10:10   #22
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I don't find it at all hard to see why people would dislike Radiohead.

Although I do like their early work.
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Old 26-03-2009, 18:43:59   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Every single person who likes Radiohead is a complete whining twat. They're worse than all of the emo bands combined, sickeningly egocentric me-music for spoilt upper-middle-class teenagers who think they're the most interesting people in the world.
there you go with the lazy 'white middle class" thing.
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Old 26-03-2009, 18:49:37   #24
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Are you denying it's music for people who feel they're entitled?
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Old 26-03-2009, 19:57:09   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by protein
people who say they don't like radiohead are lying.

You've got a point. If I was going to be totally honest I'd have to say that I really loathe the output of boss-eyed Thom and the whiney fuckers.
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Old 26-03-2009, 20:15:51   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Are you denying it's music for people who feel they're entitled?
oh come on, you're not a complete prick, don't act like one.
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Old 26-03-2009, 20:49:53   #27
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Look, I was bullied at school too, I don't feel a need to write two albums about how the world hates me, then depart from it in a giant shiny UFO powered by mental masturbation.
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Old 26-03-2009, 20:55:50   #28
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I like this weird thing called 'Music' which is lots of notes strung together in appealing way. Didn't realise it had so much to do with my sex, colour, wealth, height, age,or whether i was a vegetarian.

If analysing music to death makes you hate it, then why bother?
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Old 26-03-2009, 20:58:05   #29
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I couldn't care less whether Radiohead felt they were entitled or not. It doesn't alter the fact that their music was tedious, with the exception of "Creep" which is an excellent song.
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Old 26-03-2009, 21:05:34   #30
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I think that "Paranoid Android" might have made it as a Queen b-side if they were really struggling with writer's block.
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Old 26-03-2009, 21:10:33   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Look, I was bullied at school too, I don't feel a need to write two albums about how the world hates me, then depart from it in a giant shiny UFO powered by mental masturbation.
what have you written albums about?
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Old 26-03-2009, 21:26:46   #32
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Nothing. That's kind of the point.
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Old 26-03-2009, 22:36:04   #33
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i agree.
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Old 26-03-2009, 22:37:05   #34
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Great. Let's shake hands and be on our merry way.
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Old 27-03-2009, 10:01:06   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Look, I was bullied at school too, I don't feel a need to write two albums about how the world hates me, then depart from it in a giant shiny UFO powered by mental masturbation.
You probably deal with it in different ways. There'd be nothing wrong with that if it was how you dealt with it though. If some teenager somewhere finds it comforting to listen to someone else talking about the same shit they're feeling then that's cool. Won't work for everyone but people are different.

People can only deal with their feelings about what has happened to them in their lives. It almost doesn't matter who you are, there are very few people where you couldn't say that other people have got it harder. So fuck it, you can only deal with your own issues or write about what you know.

People who've had a decent upbringing shouldn't be allowed to make music? Or if they do, they can't sing about what they feel about stuff? Ridiculous.

And if someone wants to write music about absolutely nothing, just for the joy of writing it, then that's cool too.
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Old 27-03-2009, 10:15:09   #36
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I think I hate a certain kind of Radiohead fan, rather than the band itself (Just is a great song). Mainly the fans who thought that they'd invented the wheel with Kid A. All they'd done is spent a year going through Warp Records back catalogue. That said, I do like Everything In It's Right Place.

Oasis had their moments, Pulp have probably aged the best of all of them, their 90's stuff still sounds good, Blur were good etc etc. I'll never forgive Supergrass for playing Caught By The Fuzz acoustic at Reading Festival. Acoustic?!!! Fuckers.

The best band to come from the 'Britpop' era (and they were distinctly and determinedly anti-Britpop at the time, only lumped in as they a) British and b) were on Creation) are SFA.
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Old 27-03-2009, 10:29:50   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Funko
You probably deal with it in different ways. There'd be nothing wrong with that if it was how you dealt with it though. If some teenager somewhere finds it comforting to listen to someone else talking about the same shit they're feeling then that's cool. Won't work for everyone but people are different.

People can only deal with their feelings about what has happened to them in their lives. It almost doesn't matter who you are, there are very few people where you couldn't say that other people have got it harder. So fuck it, you can only deal with your own issues or write about what you know.

People who've had a decent upbringing shouldn't be allowed to make music? Or if they do, they can't sing about what they feel about stuff? Ridiculous.

And if someone wants to write music about absolutely nothing, just for the joy of writing it, then that's cool too.
It's a dilemma because on the one hand you obviously want musicians who are true to what they believe and what they feel. On the other hand there are definitely things better dealt with through therapy.

I think I've mentioned before how I revile the journalistic notion that depression somehow equals authenticity, and that the music of depressed people (at least those who live out their depression through their music) is somehow truer. Having since experienced depression first-hand (and second-hand) I still feel its a significantly altered state, and far from "the real person" without the weird chemicals going around the brain, making it actually "less authentic" if that's what's interesting.

All this makes the entitled pretend depression of Radiohead even less interesting. Your rhetorical question about people who've had decent upbringings making music is probably justified, but the older I've got the more I've gravitated towards the music of the working class and minorities. It's liberating to hear musicians who don't think they're automatically great but actually have to achieve something first.
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Old 27-03-2009, 11:25:51   #38
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Who says middle class musicians think they are automatically great or think they don't have to achieve anything though?

I dunno where that's coming from, other than perhaps from your own personal prejudice. I just don't think it's true, or even if it is for some it's such an unfair generalisation to tar everyone with purely because of their background.
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Old 27-03-2009, 11:49:45   #39
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I've gravitated towards the music of the working class and minorities. It's liberating to hear musicians who don't think they're automatically great but actually have to achieve something first.
is sweden stuck in the mid 70s?

i wonder if you actually don't have a musical ear and that's why you think the story behind the music is more important than the music.

give everyone on your street a piano and a tape recorder and the most talented or most determined ones will record the best tunes. although the blackest and poorest might come up with the best tune, it's not because they are black and poor.

i've lived in poverty for the last fifteen years and have no idea how that would positively affect the music i write. having working class and ethnic people in the band hasn't been a positive advantage. it hasn't affected the music at all.

scabby, get over yourself. stop rebelling against your parents and listen to music for what it is. without reading the back story. what music journalists present to you isn't anything like real life.
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Old 27-03-2009, 11:51:29   #40
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here's britain's working class music. you'll love it.

http://www.vbs.tv/video.php?id=12185178001
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Old 27-03-2009, 15:45:18   #41
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And unsurprisingly I do.

I'm totally not buying the idea that "the most talented musicians" will make the best music. If that was the case Frank Zappa would be better than Dharma, which is clearly not the case.
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Old 27-03-2009, 16:06:51   #42
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you genuinely like donk music or you think the story of donk music is interesting? have you listened to more than one donk track? how does the actual music make you feel? would you listen to a whole donk album with headphones in a darkened room paying it your full attention?

comparing one colour artist to another colour artist isn't important. it's the music that's important. compare talvin singh to lou reed if you like.

personal taste is different from person to person, that's fine but are you really a class war racist that will disregard music because of the person who wrote it? if so, that's quite frankly sickening.
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Old 27-03-2009, 16:11:11   #43
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Seriously what's not to love about Donk?
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Old 27-03-2009, 16:15:31   #44
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Quote:
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you genuinely like donk music or you think the story of donk music is interesting? have you listened to more than one donk track? how does the actual music make you feel? would you listen to a whole donk album with headphones in a darkened room paying it your full attention?
Well, I've got a couple of bouncy/Scouse compilations and I've been looking for the more MC-driven material that appears in these videos. I think the genre shows promise, though not as much as, say, bassline did a couple of years ago. (It tends to be a bit too trancey for my liking, although the pulsating energy is fairly invigorating, a bit like the hardstyle/jumpstyle music from a couple of years ago.) It's still very much on the borderline of the kind of stuff I'd normally listen to, though. I might be working myself deeper into hardcore at some point, it seems interesting.

The other questions, frankly, seem a bit irrelevant. Does ANYONE listen to donk with headphones in a darkened room?
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Old 27-03-2009, 17:20:16   #45
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Going off the subject,
whilst trying to upload all my CDs onto my ipod I wouldn't bring myself to upload Lush, or Oasis, or Pulp or Blur for that matter. Despite that I wouldn't say any of the three are shit.
Hpwever I have uploaded all my Radiohead Albums and don't care who knows it. (ok only the first 3 albums I enjoy)

Hmm 'My life story', do they count as britpop? That's probably my naughty little secret.
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Old 27-03-2009, 17:20:26   #46
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I think there's something about it in the Geneva Convention isn't there?
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Old 27-03-2009, 17:43:27   #47
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Yeah Geneva were good too.
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Old 27-03-2009, 18:48:19   #48
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Does ANYONE listen to donk with headphones in a darkened room?
the question is could anyone do it?

even the has-been trance producers behind this nonsense couldn't do it.

my racism question is still relevant though. do you think poor black artists write better music than middle class white artists?
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Old 27-03-2009, 20:10:59   #49
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That's it, this discussion has become interesting enough for me to blog it. Maybe if you want to read that huge text mass (I don't blame you if you'd rather avoid it) you can continue replying there.

http://downwithtunes.blogspot.com/2009/03/humility.html

Quote:
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do you think poor black artists write better music than middle class white artists?
Considering your "nonsense" comment, do you think the opposite?
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Old 27-03-2009, 21:08:45   #50
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I could have fun here pointing out epically pretentious musicians from non-privilleged backgrounds. Jon Anderson of Yes springs to mind.
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