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View Full Version : Clive Barkers Undying


FunkyFingers
19-09-2002, 12:18:45
A friend of mine loaned me this at the weekend, haven't got round to installing it yet, but just wondered if anybody had any experience of it? Worth playing?

I lent him System Shock 2 in exchange, and he's currently scaring himself witless!

King_Ghidra
19-09-2002, 12:21:53
are you still not playing new games because your machine looks like something tony robinson and the time team might dig up from a celtic burial mound?

FunkyFingers
19-09-2002, 12:25:55
I've still only got a P2-350 french fries with 128smegs of spam and a GeeWhizz Poo 32Smegger, so yes

King_Ghidra
19-09-2002, 12:27:26
well we both have the same gfx card at least :D

FunkyFingers
19-09-2002, 12:28:56
The guy I lent SS2 to has just upgraded to an AthlonMP2200+ with 256Megs, with a GF2, but he's about to get an ATI Radeon 90000000000 or something like that. That's where I was playing Max Payne and RTCW. Fast machine.

King_Ghidra
19-09-2002, 12:30:02
yeah the radeons are nice cards, my geforce 2 mx is starting to show its age now

Funkodrom
19-09-2002, 12:31:09
I haven't bought anything my gf2 can't handle yet.

FunkyFingers
19-09-2002, 12:32:28
It's my lack of clock cycles that's the problem I believe, not the gf2. The current Athlons are what, 8-10 times as powerful as what I've got, that's a lot of extra instructions per second

Funkodrom
19-09-2002, 12:33:24
Mine's One point twenny one jigaherrz!

FunkyFingers
19-09-2002, 12:34:10
:D

FunkyFingers
19-09-2002, 12:34:32
Great Scott Marty!

King_Ghidra
19-09-2002, 12:35:17
i thought this thread was about clive barkers dilemma over whether to use 'just for men'

Funkodrom
19-09-2002, 12:35:40
:D

Coming out on DVD soon, Nav bought them in NZ.

FunkyFingers
19-09-2002, 12:49:28
What are? Clive's Undead?

Funkodrom
19-09-2002, 12:59:57
OG
Back to the Future Trilogy.

Venom
19-09-2002, 13:11:40
jigaherz? Tell me that's a pun or a 100-0 attempt.

Funkodrom
19-09-2002, 13:16:12
It's just making sure you pronounce it like he does in the film rather than gigaherz.

Scabrous Birdseed
19-09-2002, 14:47:24
Originally posted by Funkodrom
I haven't bought anything my gf2 can't handle yet.

I didn't know you had a gf, let alone two. Do they know about each other? That #2 sounds like someone you're lucky to have.

Funkodrom
19-09-2002, 14:47:56
I'm someone she's lucky to have.

King_Ghidra
19-09-2002, 14:48:57
'gf' in this context means 'hand'

Venom
19-09-2002, 15:03:39
Originally posted by Funkodrom
It's just making sure you pronounce it like he does in the film rather than gigaherz.

You do know the correct term then I trust?

Funkodrom
19-09-2002, 15:11:26
Of course but that's not applicable to processor speed.

Venom
19-09-2002, 15:18:21
No but twisting the line of a classic film is dangerous territory.

Funkodrom
19-09-2002, 15:19:15
It's fun.

Venom
19-09-2002, 15:21:07
So is snorting cocaine of a hookers ass while driving down the highway at 130 mph with trunk load of nitroglycerine.

FunkyFingers
19-09-2002, 15:40:34
That's dangerous? Then why hasn't the government banned it yet?

Venom
19-09-2002, 15:56:35
They're too busy actually doing it.

FunkyFingers
23-09-2002, 08:50:20
Started this last night - runs acceptably well on my pc, even though I'm 100mhz under the min processor spec - must be the power of the GF2...

My first criticism is the appalling accent of the voiceover actor "playing" the lead character, it's risable!

Still, haven't done much yet, am sneaking round the convincingly creepy mansion which is haunted. I like the magic skill you have where you can "see dead people". Freaky. It's nicely styled. I haven't shot anything yet though.

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 13:55:43
Any GF2 with DDR ram will run anytihng out there decently. The only things it won't run well are the very latest (and poorly designed in some aspects) graphics engines like NetInfinity (Morrowind, though they modded it so its MUCH better, and some actual medieval net based game which runs horribly even on ti4600's as it has no occlusion culling), also Neverwinter Nights engine isn't the best when it comes to getting the most bang for the buck out of hardware.

It's simple, the higher the resolution, the faster your processor has to be along withi it's FSB (so unlock your Althons people and pump it up slowly, as it also increases processor speed - on Althons its FSBxclock multiplier, so you better have a GOOD heatsink - also .18micron althons don't OC well, .13 micron ones do, you just have to find out which you have - I can't remember the code letters, but if your interested, let me know and I can find out, and also what's there most common stable speed, along with how to check for stability). With P4's, with the newer chips and MB's which use the latest Intel or SiS chipset, your fine in the bandwidth from agp to cpu department. The newer graphics cards only offer a few new things, though those few new things, when put into a game properly, make it look outstanding. With DirectX9 coming out with all sorts of new shit, now isn't a good time to buy a graphics card, as Nvidia's are DirectX 8.1 compliant, while if you have 400 dollars to spend, go out and buy a radeon 9700 pro, it will be nearly if not fully D9 compliant (can't remember) also, a 9000 pro isn't based on the same gpu, its based on the 8000 series gpu's).

Radeons right now are still using the .15 micron process as they haven't ironed out the kinks in .13, NVidia is rumored to just have done so, so the NV30 card's details should be released, along with it's release date with a month or so I'd imagine. Their is also a huge backlog for 9700's, so the price will remain high until the NV30 comes out, which will, most likely trump the 9700, especially if it's still running at the .15 micron die. So basically, if you need performance OC a g4 4200ti, they are like 130 buck US, while a ge 4 4600ti is 200-250 and the g4 will last you for a while, you just might not see all the new features released in D9 (damned microsoft releasing features faster than card makers and game companies can use or even understand them well enough to make them work well)

For best bang for for the buck currently in overclocking is the Ge4 ti4200, only about 10-50 dollars more than a g4mx (the more expensive ones use faster DDR and chipset, so the ram can be clocked faster, and the gpu will be able to handle it, they also come with suberb heatsinks... Abit has released a very good 4200, they are about 50 bucks more, but you'll get about 315-300 gpu (up from 250), and around 750 (up from ~300). To find out how far you can overclock your ram with needlessly overclocking it, find out it's ns process, then 1000/ns * 2 will get you the max speed that the ram can effectively be overclocked at, anyhting above that is just creating latency and genertaing heat.

It's also been found the heatsinks on ram really don't help clock speeds unless your trying to get that last mhz out of it. On the gpu though, it's a neccessity. I've clocked a eVGA card, with a Delta 120mm HO blowing on it to 300/500 stable, and that card is a bottom dollar card, about 10 bucks more than a MX card. So if you want the extra 30 mhz gpu and extra 400mhz ddr, then spend 40 more than that and get an Abit. A ge4 4200 runs at 250/~300 I believe. O/Cing it with an Abit will beat out a Beat out a stock g4 4600 in any benchmark, a cheaper 4600 will beat out a stock 4400 and come close, but due to chipset bandwidth restrictions won't edge out a 4600, but will come close. The best part is, if you use the right program, and the card fry's, you can send it back and even if they check it, they won't know, as it a driver not BIOS tweak (rivatuner though WILL go into your BIOS, so don't use it). Download the latest Detonator Drivers and find the detanor hidden feature patch, it allows you to adjust the clock cycles within a safe range (200-315). To get up to (you can get up to 700 or so for the RAM with the detonator patch) to get the extra 50 for the Abit though, you'll have to use an outside program. NVmax might allow you to get it (it runs in the background and only when you start it up), rivatuner most certainly will, but they will know you O/Ced your card, so no refund if they actually bother to check unless you have a pci card you can go to and change the cards bios back if possible (sometimes it isn't).

Most 4200 cards come with 4ns ram, which means the fastest you can clock the ram without wasting energy (creating excess heat) is 500, the Abit one comes with 2.6 ns ram, which allows for 770 mhz (actually 769). So go for the g4 4200, oc it, and it will run fine, my friend has had his running for a LONG (about 6 months, now using Nvidia's O/C patch, as the others ran in the background, or went into the bios, or just weren't very user friendly - it was running at 300/500) time and it shows no signs of deteriation. To cool the card and not void the warranty, cut a hole on the side of your case and buy a Delta 120mm HO (130cfm) fan (I got mine on ebay for 8 bucks with a 92 mm as well, and mount it next to the card). It wails like a banshee (well not that loud, I don't notice it when I'm gaming, but if I'm away from the computer, it sounds like a 15" fan (mind you I have 6 120mm in mine and 4 80's mm HO Delta's along with a compressor which hums a bit).

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 13:59:31
As for Clive Barker's undying, it's a good game, but once you get a certain weapon, and combine it with a certain spell, it is cheese.

FunkyFingers
23-09-2002, 15:02:09
Even so, if your processor is short on clock cycles, it can't process all the AI and sound instructions quickly enough, or shunt triangle setup info to the card quickly enough, especially when you get a lot of enemies on screen...

I take it then that there's an uber weapon that renders the game easy-peasy?

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 15:28:53
AI makes up VERY little of what the processor is doing. At high resolutions the processor has to deal with plotting more points to feed to the gpu, thats why when you run games at 800x600 and below, the frame rates really don't change, it is when you up them that processor speed becomes apparent. Like playing Morrowind at 1600x1400, if you don't have a radeon 9700pro or a quadro 4 900 (mine's o/ced), then don't expect to get above 2 fps, I'm pulling about 25 (on a p4 at oc/d at 3.4 ghz) outdoors, even in slow outdoor areas, and above 150 indoors. The game just needs fucking occlusion culling. WHY FUCKING PROCESS THE ENTIRE FUCKING VIEW IN FRONT OF YOU WHEN YOU CAN'T SEE 90% OF IT. (IE THE SHIT WHICH IS HIDDEN BEHIND SOMETHING). Whoever made that engine was a fucking idiot, its great that Bethesda tweaked it, because Dungeon Siege (I think), some net based game, uses the base version of the engine, and it is horrible from what I hear. AI might make up 20% of what the processor is doing, and that is a big MIGHT, especially as games get higher and higher in the amount of triangles they use that the cpu will have to plot. For example, one Ordinator in Morrowind uses about half to 3/4th's the amount of triangles that a whole q3 avg. map does, including players.

As for Undying, It is all the easier, when combining that certain weapon that with another ability, if your patient, you won't die after upping the power of those specific two spells and using that weapon. Not using the spells in conjunction with the weapon though balances it out.

It is basically like having a BFG9000 of good old doom 2 that never runs out of ammo and doesn't allow you to die.

FunkyFingers
23-09-2002, 15:40:56
I'm running it at 640x480 as it is... A P2-350 is not the fastest kid on the block anymore, even with a Guffy2.
I've overclocked the GF2 as much as it'll handle, can't remember the exact figures, but again, games seem to chug as a result of lack of processor power/main memory more than anything else on my pc - Black and White for example - there is a lot of AI calculation going on there, and if you zoom in/out quickly, you can see it loading up new textures out of memory as the memory bandwidth just can't keep up.

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 17:07:49
Textures take up most of your memory, AI in some games can take up a significant portion, but the better the graphics (3D speaking), the more shortcuts there are in the AI. That's why it's hard to get good AI. It isn't that the programmers don't know how, it is that they have to get the game to run on as low a system as the graphics engine will perform decently, then take a small portion of that and dedicate it to AI which slightly ups the CPU power required.

Yeah, your games are chugging because of lack of processor power. If you can afford it, buy a cheap MB (dfi and biostar make some good cheap boards if your not an O/Cer (processor wise), you just might have to add a fan (5 bucks) to the northbridge if it doesn't have a heatsink or any cooling on it), a duron processor (1ghz on up) and 512 of 2100ddr (only slightly more expensive than pc-133), if you can't afford the ddr, get a mb that supports standard pc100-133 SDRAM. With DDR, it would be around 250 US give or take 50 depending on vendor, without, 25-50 lower. Use your existing case components and case and it should work, though you might have to upgrade your power supply if you have plenty of drives if it's below 250. I personally wouldn't put anything below 300 in a new PC, but for revamping an old one, if its at 250, it should handle it fine... 300's which are AMD/Intel approved aren't too expensive, add another 50-75$ to the final cost.

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 17:44:00
If your going all out though, get an Althon 1800+ with a k333 or in a few months, after all the kinks have been ironed out the k400 chipset, get one of those (either an Asus, Abit, or a Gigabyte board, they should be released soon). DDR 3200 does not improve performance over ddr 2700, on either p4's or althons even with chipsets that support it. DDR 3200 isn't approved by JEDEC either, 2700 is, and will be cheaper and give you better performance. That's the best bang for your buck, and with a newer .13 micron althon, you can o/c it to probably 2200-2400 with an aftermarket fan and heatsink.

FunkyFingers
23-09-2002, 20:51:45
When I'm definitely in the market for new pc powerness, it will be via the O/clockable Athlon route - I used to bullseye womprats in my T-16 back home when I had a P-75 running at 120 and a 3DFX Voodoo1...

I'm a real geeky-tinkerer of pcs, so overclocking has always appealed.

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 21:05:06
Get a good heatsink, if you aren't into water cooling, or 900-1500 dollars for compression cooling, go with a good heatsink and fan combo with excellent case airflow. On my aircooled duron 1200 runing at 1450 (high end durons aren't too o/c abled), that's an average overclock, counting people with watercooling, etc, I have a thermaltake volcano 9, four delta 120mm fans and 4 60mm delta thick fans... this case is about as loud as my compressor system, only about 2 gigahertz slower (well 5, dual processors), and a lot cheaper. :) If you want the best cooling, make sure the mb has four holes on side of the socket, and 80mms of clear space around the socket total... ie, 40 mm from the center of the socket... then you can mount an alpha or swiftech heatsink, get a 80to120mm funnel adapter, and a delta 120 blowing at 190CFM.

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 21:08:18
Gigabyte, Asus, and Abit generally have versions of mb's that are geared toward the O/Cer

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 21:16:03
You do know how to unlock an Althon chip though, right? Find the backside, it has markers, L1, L2, etc... find the L1 markers, go over them and connect each set of 2 : : : : to be I I I I (like jumpers) with a very finely sharpened lead pencil (the lead is enough to induce enough conductivitiy to unlock it), go over and around each 'pin' and connect to the other on at least 15 to 20 times. That way, if it burns up, you can erase the evidence and return it, if you use silver epoxies on the market, which is also harder to use correctly, it's permanent... you've bburnt up your cpu and acn't get a replacement without buying one... though they are cheap. Make sure your althon is a 0.13 micron, not a 0.18, as you'll get shit o/c results from the 0.18 ones.

Foetus
23-09-2002, 22:19:15
Yeah, I really enjoyed Undying. It is pretty easy though. Quite creepy in places too.

No longer Trippin
23-09-2002, 22:26:47
yes it is, it just doesn't have much replay value, but if you can get it cheap or free, its an excellent game... just once you know the storyline and everything, thats the whole part of the game, so it's not nearly as interesting.

FunkyFingers
24-09-2002, 08:28:43
got Undying for free - swapped it with a mate who's got my copy of SS2...

I remember there used piece of software called SoftFSB which you could use to up the FSB clock from within Windoze, rather than from your BIOS but it never worked on my existing P2 as it has a spastic Intel mobie. I like the idea of getting a pencil out and drawing in a shorting circuit though to unlock the clock lock, that's pretty darn cool.

Will probably get round to getting a new/upgrade pc in 2003.

No longer Trippin
25-09-2002, 01:00:43
With the new Duron's 1.2 ghz and up, they are already set at the maximum safe voltage for Durons 1.85 volts, and they come unlocked already (as the laser which severs the connectors on the cache winds up damaging some cahces, resulting in useless cpu's. So the new one's come unlocked, they still lock them on the Durons. I can't get my 1200 to even go up 1mhz fsb (which would raise the processor core speed) without it getting into windows and locking up when the 2000pro screen starts up, the bar goes halfway, and then just stops, I'm going to try jumper setting it and see what it does.

No longer Trippin
25-09-2002, 01:02:23
This is on the new mb I got, I can overclock it quite a bit on the old one, just wanted to upgrade the MB as it was a cheap POS, and the chipset itself was a bottleneck, not the cpu, with this one, the cpu becomes the bottleneck unless I can use jumpers to get around it.

FunkyFingers
30-09-2002, 20:48:10
Well, enjoying this game so far and it runs very well on my pc, apart from one section in the "nether world" where it went in to herko-jerko mode for a minute...

Am currently having good fun killing donkeys then re-animating them, which is perversely amusing!

FunkyFingers
21-10-2002, 09:49:07
Bah, this game has got monotonous - too many of those jumping rippy-uppy-your-facey monsters and not much else. Using the invoke spell to kill skeletons was a good ruse though. Very samey at the moment. Come on, give me something new to do :bash: