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Caligastia
13-09-2002, 16:36:50
Hopefully Protein will see this as he is rumored to be good at this kind of thing.

I got cakewalk and sound forge recently, and have begun experimenting with recording my guitar. I have tried hooking up my guitar directly to the sound card, and it sounds ok but then I dont get that heavy distortion sound. I get more background hum by hooking up the amp but at least I get distortion. I was thinking that if I installed some effects into cakewalk I could bypass the amp altogether. Also maybe sound forge has some effects.

Does anyone have any advice?

Vincent
13-09-2002, 16:44:14
maybe you can get a SansAmp, a stomp box with amp simulation. I used it several times and it's OK

Vincent
13-09-2002, 16:47:08
http://www.sansamp.com/Images/Pedals/GT2/G200.jpg

www.sansamp.com

Caligastia
13-09-2002, 16:52:18
Cool, how much did it cost?

Vincent
13-09-2002, 16:55:15
I bougt it 5 years ago for about 170 Euros, I think. It's probably much cheaper in the US now or via ebay etc...

Caligastia
13-09-2002, 16:57:12
Im assuming it cits down on the amp hum a fair bit?

Vincent
13-09-2002, 17:23:01
You don't need an amp. It simulates different kinds of amps and cabinets with a decent quality

Vincent
13-09-2002, 17:24:35
Of course some humming is normal, you may use an EQ to reduce it (on the PC or an external device).

Debaser
13-09-2002, 18:19:09
As far as I can remember Protein puts his guitar through a multi-effects then straight into Cakewalk. He definately doesn't go through an amp. Doesn't Cakewalk have built in effects anyway?

Funkodrom
13-09-2002, 18:37:37
Cakewalk has some great distortion effects, they are much better than putting a distorted guitar into the soundcard.

The pod amp simulators are really good as well. RC has one of those.

Caligastia
13-09-2002, 18:52:14
I dont have any effects loaded onto my copy of Cakewalk, as its a copy from a friend. Does anyone have any they could send me?

Also, is there any way to hear what you are playing through your computer speakers as you are playing it? If I listen really carefully I can hear it, but its very faint.

Vincent
13-09-2002, 19:20:46
Since the level of a electric guitar is to low, you need some gain, a preamp to get line level. I recommend some of the devices above (Pod, Sans Amp, C@H has a chaep but nice Behringer preamp).

Another way is to use the preamp of your gutar amp. It should have a post preamp exit (FX loop, aux, or something like that) on line level. But that way you'll miss the warm distorted sound of the power amp.

Caligastia
13-09-2002, 19:36:26
Thanks a lot for the info Vincent.
Do you know if there is any kind of preamp that connects through USB?

Vincent
13-09-2002, 19:58:27
Never heard of one. Usually they are not especially designed for computers, you can use them with your guitar amp as fx, boosters or alternative preamp.

Caligastia
13-09-2002, 20:16:04
I see. I was talking with this guy who had one that goes in through USB, but he has a mac.

Vincent
14-09-2002, 08:09:30
USB is USB.

Maybe this thingy. Looks great:
http://www.edirol.com/products/info/ua700.html

Vincent
14-09-2002, 08:12:03
The brand Edirol (a part of Roland) sounds terrible.

Like some dumb rolleyes techno ripoff (Edi aus Tirol)

PosterBoy
15-09-2002, 09:46:10
I'm starting to play with Cool edit 2000. But I do mostly acoustic stuff, the noise reduction on it is brilliant.
It's just a shame it is only got 4 tracks in the multi track mode, but you can bounce down.

protein
16-09-2002, 11:44:51
I managed to download some great cakewalk plug-ins using edonkey. One is called 'amp sim' and it does exactly what it says on the tin. It has presets ranging from American lead to British crunch and sounds pretty darn good. It even has settings to chose the kind of virtual peaker cabinet you want to play through. This effect is for applying after recording and not in 'real time' so if you have to hear the distortion during playing, get a distortion pedal.

Other great effects I got for free are 'SoundStage' where you are presented with a 3d image of a room, virtual mics and a speaker. It's like a really advanced reverb. Antares Auto Tune is also great fun for those Cher/Dane Bowers type vocal effects.

To get any free software, download edonkey and search for it and eventually your computer will start downloading it for you. For the plug-ins try typing 'cake plug' in to the search bit (although it may come up with some really disturbing porn).
I would also search for 'serials 2002' to get all the serial numbers for the software.

Remember: This is all illegal so don't do anything that I say.

Caligastia
16-09-2002, 13:05:27
Thanks Protein. I am guessing edonkey is a morpheus/kazaa file sharing program. I have had problems configuring my router for those things. I'll give it another try though.

Caligastia
16-09-2002, 13:47:50
Originally posted by Vincent
USB is USB.


I know, but the guy seemed to think that you could only get such a device for macs. I guess you proved him wrong...:D

Caligastia
16-09-2002, 18:24:34
Is there any way I can apply an effect to my guitar that will save me from buying a bass guitar to record bass tracks?

Debaser
16-09-2002, 19:00:23
Can you download a pitchshift effect, or adjust the pitch of something once it has been recorded?

Caligastia
16-09-2002, 19:13:12
Probably. I will have a look in my cakewalk book.

MattHiggs
16-09-2002, 21:46:59
Do you need some sort of special device to hook up your guitar to the soundcard? I have an SB Live! and obviously my lead won't go straight into it. It'd be nice to use my computer as a decent amp.

Funkodrom
17-09-2002, 08:22:34
You can get a big to little adaptor which works fine. Alternatively if you put the guitar into an effects board or something like a 4 track or a seperate mixer you can use a line out from that into the PC.

MattHiggs
17-09-2002, 09:51:27
Big to little adapter sounds likr the best (cheapest) option ;)

Funkodrom
17-09-2002, 09:51:57
Aye. :D

Funkodrom
17-09-2002, 09:52:45
Other thing of course is to put a mic in front of your amp. Not good quality unless you have a good amp and a good mic though.

FunkyFingers
17-09-2002, 10:59:11
And cables.

Funkodrom
17-09-2002, 11:12:30
Yes, and a guitar. :rolleyes:

FunkyFingers
17-09-2002, 11:26:42
And strings

Funkodrom
17-09-2002, 11:27:58
You can save the string section until you have the basics down I think.

FunkyFingers
17-09-2002, 11:28:50
Yeah, best to stick with playing the recorder till you get the hang of it

protein
17-09-2002, 11:52:26
Originally posted by Caligastia
Is there any way I can apply an effect to my guitar that will save me from buying a bass guitar to record bass tracks?
no.
I have tried that sort of thing and it doesn't work. In my opinion you should never try and emulate a bass guitar, there are many other interesting ways of making bass noises. The best thing to do is to use a keyboard if you don't have a bass guitar but don't have it on the 'bass guitar' section, it will sound shit. maybe a low piano or squelchy analogue noise.

I'd borrow a bass if I were you. When you record bass remember to compress it - it sounds much better.

FunkyFingers
17-09-2002, 12:05:50
Don't compress it too much though, unless you like that sort of thing.
Agree, synth bass, or octave dropped bass from guitars sound awful, much better to get a real one, or not at all.

Caligastia
17-09-2002, 14:10:18
Originally posted by protein
I'd borrow a bass if I were you. When you record bass remember to compress it - it sounds much better.

What does compressing it do? How does it change the sound?

I was messing around with those effects you sent me (thanks very much BTW:)), and I managed to get some nice clear sounds going with the delay etc, but Im finding it hard to get that really heavy crunchy distortion sound that I like. None of the amps in the amp sim really do it for me. Perhaps I should apply more than one amp effect...:hmm: That ultra-heavy distortion is my favorite sound, so I really want to get it right if I can. So far though it sounds better to play through my amp (for that particular sound) than use the effects. Also the amp sim seems to simulate a lot of amp hum, how can I get rid of that?

FunkyFingers
17-09-2002, 14:27:35
Compression (I hope this is'nt a 100-nil!) - it evens out the volume of a given source. What this does is raises the gain on quietly played notes, and attenuates the gain on loudly played notes.
What you find on a bass, especially on not-particularly-skilled players (no offence) is that when you record it, it just sounds really lumpy - all attack on the start of the note note, but no rest of note as it dies out in the mix. Compress it a bit and it smoothens it all out. Compress it too much though and it'll just sound flat and lifeless.

protein
17-09-2002, 14:38:49
On the amp sim, try British Crunch and slide the distortion fader to the top. Use a 12x4 speaker cab. Make sure that your guitar signal is strong enough otherwize it might sound weak.
The best way I have found to record guitars is to use the Nirvana method of having two distorted guitar tracks (same guitar part played twice) Have one panned hard left and the other hard right. It gives an enormous distorted wall of lovelyness!

Caligastia
17-09-2002, 15:09:17
Originally posted by FunkyFingers
Compression (I hope this is'nt a 100-nil!) - it evens out the volume of a given source. What this does is raises the gain on quietly played notes, and attenuates the gain on loudly played notes.
What you find on a bass, especially on not-particularly-skilled players (no offence) is that when you record it, it just sounds really lumpy - all attack on the start of the note note, but no rest of note as it dies out in the mix. Compress it a bit and it smoothens it all out. Compress it too much though and it'll just sound flat and lifeless.

I see. I actually started out on the bass guitar, so Im sure I can still manage to hammer out a decent bass track. I normally play bass with my fingers, so perhaps that would naturally even things out a bit...?

Caligastia
17-09-2002, 15:15:23
Originally posted by protein
On the amp sim, try British Crunch and slide the distortion fader to the top. Use a 12x4 speaker cab. Make sure that your guitar signal is strong enough otherwize it might sound weak.

I have been recording my guitar signal low enough for it not to distort with clear sound, and then apply the distortion effect. Perhaps I should up the volume because if I am applying a distortion effect to it, it doesnt matter if its a bit distorted already does it?

The best way I have found to record guitars is to use the Nirvana method of having two distorted guitar tracks (same guitar part played twice) Have one panned hard left and the other hard right. It gives an enormous distorted wall of lovelyness!

Sounds good, I will try it. Do you just clone the track?

I have a question about recording from my drum machine. Basically I dont have any way of hooking up the midi port to my pc, so I am just recording L-audio. How can I take that resulting drum track that only plays through the left speaker and balance it through both speakers?

Funkodrom
17-09-2002, 15:20:25
Sounds better if you play it again rather than cloning if you can play it well both times. Sounds more real.

protein
17-09-2002, 15:29:20
Cloning will cause a phaze effect and each channel will cancel each other out and will be pretty much mono.

Play the track again.

when you right click the little speaker at the bottom of your screen on the task bar you can tell your computer where you want to record the sound source from. You should have a stereo input at the back of your computer next to your output.
Find the right leads to hook up your drum machine to the stereo input.
It will all be a horrible nightmare sorting out your set up - at least it was for me!

Caligastia
17-09-2002, 15:34:33
Originally posted by protein
when you right click the little speaker at the bottom of your screen on the task bar you can tell your computer where you want to record the sound source from. You should have a stereo input at the back of your computer next to your output.

I am already hooked up to the stereo input on my sound card, but the problem is that my drum machine only has a L-out and R-out for stereo or L/Mono-out. Basically I dont have a single Stereo-out port in my drum machine.

FunkyFingers
17-09-2002, 15:54:14
Connect only one channel at a time?

Cali- I've been playing bass for 15 years and I always use compression - both for gigging and recording. I never use a pick to play, always fingers or slap. It just helps!

Chorus and delay both work well on bass by the way if you want some nice bass effects if you've got a bass line that can come out at some point.

protein
17-09-2002, 15:57:15
Does your drum machine have a headphone out? I'd go to your local hi fi store and get a load of leads if I were you. You could always ask them to make the lead for you.
When I got Cakewalk I recorded everything on to stereo tracks even when I was recording a mono source. This is really wasteful. Incase you didn't know, you can change the track properties to make tracks mono or stereo.

Caligastia
17-09-2002, 15:59:49
Originally posted by FunkyFingers
Connect only one channel at a time?

You mean record the left on one track then the right on another? I dont know how I can sync them up perfectly.


Cali- I've been playing bass for 15 years and I always use compression - both for gigging and recording. I never use a pick to play, always fingers or slap. It just helps!

Chorus and delay both work well on bass by the way if you want some nice bass effects if you've got a bass line that can come out at some point.

Ok, I'll take your word for it.;)