PDA

View Full Version : Doom III


MattHiggs
22-05-2002, 23:56:25
OH MY GOD

http://doom3.gamesweb.com/downloads/downloads.php3?file=5

Check out this 7 minute trailer of Doom III and prepare to be amazed!

Here are some screenshots.

http://www.gamespy.com/e32002/pc/doom3b/9.jpg

http://www.gamespy.com/e32002/pc/doom3b/11.jpg

Deacon
23-05-2002, 10:01:33
Long live PC gaming.

MattHiggs
23-05-2002, 10:29:35
The game will not be released on PS2 as serious cut backs would have to be made to get it to run.

It will be released on X-Box.

FunkyFingers
23-05-2002, 10:58:22
I take it my P-350 with a GF2 is not going to be up to the job of running that. B'ah, death to PC gaming and it's upgrading treadmill.
Looks danged impressive though!

Funkodrom
23-05-2002, 10:59:00
Downloaded it but it doesn't run on this machine. Fuck.

Snapcase
23-05-2002, 11:14:39
I still think it looks shit. The bathroon shot is cool, but the other ones look like they used the sprite artist from Blood or something to design the creature textures. Plastic feel.

MattHiggs
23-05-2002, 11:28:05
The textures are good. Designed in really high resolution, you can see the throbbing veigns on enemies. Just imaging shooting that fat guys head off. It's the closest thing I have to killing Venom.

Look at the bags under the eyes, look at the eybrows. The detail is amazing and the creatures look scary!

MattHiggs
23-05-2002, 11:34:20
Here is an interview with John Carmack about Doom III :

http://www.gamespy.com/e32002/pc/carmack/

MattHiggs
23-05-2002, 11:35:22
'The process of building the new engine went much more smoothly than anything we have done before, because I was able to do all the groundwork while the rest of the company worked on TeamArena. By the time they were ready to work on it, things were basically functional'

The guy is a genius, I'm so glad that John Romero fucked up.

MattHiggs
23-05-2002, 11:38:33
Originally posted by FunkyFingers
I take it my P-350 with a GF2 is not going to be up to the job of running that. B'ah, death to PC gaming and it's upgrading treadmill.
Looks danged impressive though!

I still think that overall, the GeForce 4 Ti is the best card you can buy. It has high speed and excellent driver quality.

Based on the feature set, the Radeon 8500 should be a faster card for Doom than the GF4, because it can do the seven texture accesses that I need in a single pass, while it takes two or three passes (depending on details) on the GF4. However, in practice, the GF4 consistently runs faster due to a highly efficient implementation. For programmers, the 8500 has a much nicer fragment path than the GF4, with more general features and increased precision, but the driver quality is still quite a ways from Nvidia's, so I would be a little hesitant to use it as a primary research platform.

The GF4-MX is a very fast card for existing games, but it is less well suited to Doom, due to the lower texture unit count and the lack of vertex shaders.

On a slow CPU with all features enabled, the GF3 will be faster than the GF4-MX, because it offloads some work. On systems with CPU power to burn, the GF4 may still be faster.

The 128 bit DDR GF2 systems will be faster than the Radeon-7500 systems, again due to low level implementation details overshadowing the extra texture unit.

The slowest cards will be the 64 bit and SDR ram GF and Radeon cards, which will really not be fast enough to play the game properly unless you run at 320x240 or so.

FunkyFingers
23-05-2002, 11:57:25
Exactly - so I can either spend 1000 quid on a new pc to play Doom3, or 200 quid on the predicted Ex-Box version?

Venom
23-05-2002, 12:32:19
That game looks crazy. It won't possibly run on anything less than 800 or 900 I bet.

Funkodrom
23-05-2002, 13:57:58
I just watched the video, fuck Doom III I want to play Doom II again.

Snapcase
23-05-2002, 15:45:23
I've got Doom 2 on CD somewhere...

FunkyFingers
23-05-2002, 16:23:46
I've got Doom2 on 5 floppy disks somewhere

Sean
23-05-2002, 16:27:00
Hmm. High res, but terrible character design. I’m with Snapcase on this one.

FunkyFingers
23-05-2002, 16:47:55
If this was an Aliens game, then we'd be really fecking scared...

When's this coming out? Perhaps the new PC might go back on the shopping list afterall... How much for a 2Ghz Athlon with a GF4?!

MattHiggs
23-05-2002, 17:10:20
Think you can pick one up for about 600.

Sean
23-05-2002, 17:11:09
The whole PC or just the Athlon and GeForce :p?

MattHiggs
23-05-2002, 17:18:35
My mate got one from Tescos, of all places, for 599.

Athlon 1.8
GeForce 4
256 DDR
60Gb HD
etc..

Funkodrom
23-05-2002, 17:42:09
Originally posted by FunkyFingers
I've got Doom2 on 5 floppy disks somewhere

If you find them could you e-mail it to me at home?

FunkyFingers
24-05-2002, 08:35:34
Originally posted by MattHiggs
My mate got one from Tescos, of all places, for 599.

Athlon 1.8
GeForce 4
256 DDR
60Gb HD
etc..

Blimey! Should get quite a few clubcard points as well :D

That's a lot of kit for 600 quid.

FunkyFingers
24-05-2002, 08:36:13
Originally posted by MikeH
If you find them could you e-mail it to me at home?

Yeah! I actually installed it again a few months back, quality!

Funkodrom
24-05-2002, 09:42:19
On my old PC I just used to fire it up and play through as far as possible without saving. Normally got bored around about Dead Simple or level 9 which is a bit of a pain.

Sean
29-05-2002, 20:45:08
OK, I watched the video. This looks like it could, possibly, be the scariest game I have played since System Shock 2 or Thief. It doesn’t look like it will have the sheer ‘oh shit’ factor of the Return to the Cathedral, but the animation is amazing and it is suitably claustrophobic.

Herman
30-05-2002, 06:53:43
The characters are being designed by the same guy from Shrek, and each character is currently about 2000-6000 polygons a piece, and they're also going to make higher polycount chars for closeup cinematics.

It's quite obvious that the people who say the characters look like shit haven't the slightest clue about the technology behind making the characters look that good. To make it the detail you guys are expecting, the polycounts would need to be about 20000-50000 per char. Which is completely unreasonable.

Look at it this way: The most a top of the line Ti4600 GF4 can pump is 10MPolys/second in real world conditions with 1 light (DOOM3 will have more, obviously) and 1 texture. DOOM 3 is using variable # of lights and 7 texture layers, so this number is far lower.

So let's say the characters comprise this 6000 polygons each, and let's say 6 of them onscreen at once. 36000 polygons right there. The rooms themselves will probably have something like 100,000 polygons a piece. Total: 136000 polygons per frame.

30 frames/second requires 4.08MPolys/second
60 frames/second requires 8.16MPolys/second.

If you guys want more detail than this, then you'd better be prepared to run this only on the GeForce 6 when it comes out.

The revolutionary part of DOOM3 isn't the polygon counts, like it was with Quake III, but the lighting engine. This is true lighting, and each new light effectively halves performance since it needs to calculate light on every pixel on the screen. No game has ever done full out per-pixel lighting before, and the results are incredibly realistic lighting that puts past games to shame. Not to mention the gratuitous use of bump mapping.

Sean
30-05-2002, 08:25:57
No, we are criticising the design of the characters, not the technical specifications, you buffoon.

Herman
30-05-2002, 08:27:40
The design is DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM

Snapcase's "plastic feel" comment is usually leveled against low poly characters since they don't have lots of detail to them.

Sean
30-05-2002, 08:27:54
Oh, and the shadows are too solid at the moment.

Herman
30-05-2002, 08:31:21
Did you guys want the cartoony look of the original DOOM games or something?

Perhaps id will follow in the footsteps of Nintendo and have DOOM III cell shaded. That'd be neat!

FunkyFingers
30-05-2002, 08:36:22
As you say, it's all in the lighting.
Whether it'll be scary or not though is not necessarily down to the quality of the graphics, but in the way it builds suspense in the scenarios - System Shock 2 was incredibly frightening in a psychologically scary way: Quake3 was not scary.

Herman
30-05-2002, 08:40:28
I'm going to start a petition to give DOOM III the Zelda cell-shaded look

Who is with me?

Sean
30-05-2002, 08:47:26
Inappropriate for the game. Doom III, as you so ably proved, is for fanboys who sit at their computers all day and count polygons.

Herman
30-05-2002, 08:51:19
DOOM III isn't about the game -- it's about the engine.

Look at all of the latest Carmack games, they're all downhill.

I don't really care for the DOOM III game, but the engine is incredible. And that's what most FPSes will be based off in the next five years. :D

Herman
30-05-2002, 08:52:22
We already know it won't be the same type of game as the original DOOMs. There are going to be very few monsters on the screen at once, and it'll be more akin to a survival horror game than a FPS.

Sean
30-05-2002, 09:03:00
Originally posted by Herman
DOOM III isn't about the game -- it's about the engine.
Oh, really? So that is why they are making it single player with fewer monsters.

Herman
30-05-2002, 09:12:44
It's an attempt to make a real game again.
Something like 20% of id's revenues comes from games they make, the rest is all licensing the engine out.

They figure they can make the engine and have some people kludge a game on top of it during the process. They're making a better attempt at it this time compared to Quake III, but it won't come close to capturing the DOOM feeling.

The Wolfenstein sequel was disappointing as well.

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 09:19:06
I just wanna play Doom II again. FUNKY!

Snapcase
30-05-2002, 10:51:12
Asher, back when Duke Nukem 3D was king, the poly counts were not dissimilar in character modelling when that technique was used. The difference was, of course, that they were pre-rendered sprites in the final game. This looks like an advanced version of games like Blood, where you'd have these shoddily-designed 3D models turned into sprites that'd invariably look like the work of an incompetent amateur who douesn't know how to do people and skin surfaces properly. The difference being that these are not pre-rendered, of course, but live. Doesn't make them any less ill-modelled...

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 10:51:46
Duke Nukem 3D was so much better than Quake.

Nav
30-05-2002, 10:55:02
'Specially the bits with the strippers... :nervous:

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 10:59:24
Mind you I never played Quake deathmatch. Single player was really dull. Never got through the first episode 'cause it was so boring.

Duke Nukem is one of the few games I actually liked enough to complete.

Snapcase
30-05-2002, 11:05:30
As per usual, I spent most of my Duke Nukem 3d time editing levels using the brilliant map editor. It was also the first game I ever played Deathmatch on, when one of my friends bought his PC over to my house... Ahhh... Null Modem Cables.

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 11:23:47
I played hours and hours of Duke Nukem on a Null Modem. I could identify where someone is on a level just from the sound effects coming from their machine. A massive advantage. :D

Venom
30-05-2002, 12:32:30
Duke Nuken 3d ruled all.

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 12:48:22
Yep.

Snapcase
30-05-2002, 12:55:29
Totally. One of my favourite games ever.

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 13:02:15
Yeah, me too.

Venom
30-05-2002, 13:19:53
Now if they could only get the other Duke Nuken out the door.

Snapcase
30-05-2002, 15:32:33
Humour by self-contradiction again, I see.

FunkyFingers
30-05-2002, 15:56:20
Originally posted by Funkodrom
I just wanna play Doom II again. FUNKY!

I apologise for not emailing the discs to you, I will do so as soon as I remember

FunkyFingers
30-05-2002, 15:59:03
Originally posted by Funkodrom
I played hours and hours of Duke Nukem on a Null Modem. I could identify where someone is on a level just from the sound effects coming from their machine. A massive advantage. :D

I loved it when we had our null-modem cable hanging out the window connecting up the two rooms, heh!

Doom2 was excellent MP, as was Descent I seemed to remember, but then yes DN3D was the ultimate. Such a fun game, but so good too.

The new game - Duke Nukem Taking Forever? I doubt we'll ever see it released. It's got continual feature bloat.

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 16:02:59
You never read your PMs do you?

Can you read them and edit that post?

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 16:04:11
Just remembered why.. sent you an e-mail

FunkyFingers
30-05-2002, 16:07:28
Done sir

Sean
30-05-2002, 16:28:28
Bah. Quake was much better. Even now I play Quake deathmatch sometimes. It is one of the most intense multiplayer experiences available.

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 17:34:26
Originally posted by FunkyFingers


I apologise for not emailing the discs to you, I will do so as soon as I remember

That's OK mate. :D Thanks.

Venom
30-05-2002, 18:20:02
KILL HIM FOR HIS TARDINESS!!!!

Funkodrom
30-05-2002, 18:20:40
I'd rather kill him for his Tardis.

Sean
30-05-2002, 18:21:55
:cry:, I was jsut about to make that joke.

Venom
30-05-2002, 18:22:13
Just kill him.

Venom
30-05-2002, 18:23:29
I think that should be my motto. Like Nike's just do it. I have just kill it.

Herman
31-05-2002, 05:40:24
DOOM III was running at "medium" quality at E3 due to problems on the beta ATI hardware it was running on, according to Carmack. Amazing. :D

Sean
31-05-2002, 07:54:00
Yes. And he chose ATI over nVidia, as well.

Herman
31-05-2002, 07:58:15
Because ATI had its R300 (next-gen card) running on silicon and Nvidia didn't have its NV30 (next-gen card) running yet. The R300 is faster than NV25 (GeForce 4), but he hasn't compared it to the NV30.

id software still develops DOOM 3 on GeForce 4 Ti4600s though.

FunkyFingers
31-05-2002, 08:59:50
So he's developing the game to run on hardware that most people haven't got. Commence viscious upgrade cycle Captain

Sean
31-05-2002, 09:01:42
But he has been doing that for ages. It isn’t coming out now, it is coming out in the future.

Herman
31-05-2002, 09:02:49
That's kinda the idea, Funky.

The game is due out in 2003 sometimes. The GeForce 4s will be 1-1.5 years old by the time this game is out, which is like 2-3 generations of video cards. :)

Also keep in mind that these engines last like 4 years for games. When they first come out it won't run on most people's computers, but gamers will eventually upgrade to have capable machines.

(Flashbacks to how Quake III got choppy on my state-of-the-art TNT2 Ultra years ago :D)

Sean
31-05-2002, 09:03:49
Yes, it is rather like criticising Bungie for developing on the Xbox before anybody had one.

Sean
31-05-2002, 09:04:36
Quake III ran fine on my Voodoo 2, BTW.

Herman
31-05-2002, 09:06:07
Your Voodoo 2 hardly ran on the highest settings like 32-bit colors and large textures. It couldn't handle it in hardware.

I'm talking max quality.

Sean
31-05-2002, 09:06:37
But it was easier to see what was going on in lower quality.

Herman
31-05-2002, 09:07:58
:lol:

Sean
31-05-2002, 09:09:45
Eh? It’s a multi-player game: you put simple items on, force player model on something nice and bright, reduce the textures to a sludge, and increase your FOV.

Herman
31-05-2002, 09:11:42
Real men play in wireframe.