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Lazarus and the Gimp
25-03-2009, 21:05:29
I was trying to think of the good stuff that came out of Britop. And I couldn't. It really was an awful time.

protein
25-03-2009, 21:39:27
blur did a couple of good songs, oasis had some absolute smashers, although you kind of forget that because they are twats. radiohead were the best of the bunch. i quite liked kulashaker.

Lazarus and the Gimp
25-03-2009, 21:47:40
I've never heard an Oasis song that I liked. Radiohead are too prog to fit the bill (and I'm no fan anyway).

Anyone find themselves humming hits by Echobelly or Gene lately? Thought not.

Scabrous Birdseed
25-03-2009, 23:12:53
Does Pulp count? I quite like some of their material.

protein
26-03-2009, 02:54:37
Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp
I've never heard an Oasis song that I liked. Radiohead are too prog to fit the bill (and I'm no fan anyway).

Anyone find themselves humming hits by Echobelly or Gene lately? Thought not.

there can be a difference between whether you like something and whether you recognise that a song is good.

but if you don't like radiohead there's something wrong with your brain. ;)

Lazarus and the Gimp
26-03-2009, 06:17:14
Oh, there's a couple of decent songs on "The Bends", but I thought "OK Computer" was a joke. The sound of a band determinedly heading up its own bum.

Funko
26-03-2009, 09:58:45
Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp
I was trying to think of the good stuff that came out of Britop. And I couldn't. It really was an awful time.

Agreed.

I did like the first Oasis album when it came out, but I can't imagine putting it on to listen to now. The new stuff I was listening to then was mainly dance (most of which was mainly drug induced and actually terrible) and hip-hop.

Stuff from pre and post britpop era I listen to all the time, of my brit-pop albums... nothing really.

Debaser
26-03-2009, 12:02:59
Elastica had loads of good songs on their first record, Parklife is full of amazing amazing songs, Pulp made at least 3 excellent albums, every record Supergrass have released is great, and Oasis still have their moments.

The problem with Britpop wasn't really the big bands, it was more the glut of generic Camden shit that came in its wake, that whole jaunty, strings and (worse) horns on everything sound. And Ocean Colour Scene.

Funko
26-03-2009, 12:15:05
Does Supergrass count as britpop? I would never have put them in that boat, but if so they are still great.

Nills Lagerbaak
26-03-2009, 12:17:03
I don't own ANY britpop albums, and I am pleased about that.

I think even my sister recognises the shiteness of it and she had loads of britpop music.

MoSe
26-03-2009, 13:27:15
Originally posted by Funko
Does Supergrass count as britpop? I would never have put them in that boat, but if so they are still great.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britpop

At the start of 1995 Britpop bands including Sleeper, Supergrass, and Menswear scored pop hits

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Britpop_musicians

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supergrass

Of that all, I only think I ever heard 2 or 3 songs by Oasis which I forgot, and one by Blur which I liked and still sometimes hum

Nills Lagerbaak
26-03-2009, 13:30:49
urgh I was trying to forget about Divine comedy, boo radleys and dodgy. Particularly dodgy.

MoSe
26-03-2009, 13:35:30
wow

you also had:

Britpop related bands
Britpop second wave

what else?
Teh Return of the Britpop
Britpop Strikes Back
Britpop: attack of teh clones

MOBIUS
26-03-2009, 16:28:51
Britpop and the raiders of the lost album?
Britpop and the turntable of doom?
Britpop and the last CD?

:nervous:

Scabrous Birdseed
26-03-2009, 16:38:07
Well, honestly, the genre as an idea is fairly awful, and some of the individual bands involved are my absolutely least favourite of all time (ESPECIALLY Blur and Radiohead, no mitigating songs for either). But I don't mind some of the Oasis stuff, and Pulp if Jarvis Cocker wasn't fronting would be largely excellent.

Lazarus and the Gimp
26-03-2009, 16:48:08
Originally posted by Debaser
Elastica had loads of good songs on their first record


When they stopped plagiarising Wire they revealed themselves to be rather uninspired.

Lazarus and the Gimp
26-03-2009, 16:49:33
Oh fuck. I'd forgotten about Cast. They were waaay beyond bad.

protein
26-03-2009, 16:59:09
people who say they don't like radiohead are lying.

Scabrous Birdseed
26-03-2009, 17:05:31
Every single person who likes Radiohead is a complete whining twat. They're worse than all of the emo bands combined, sickeningly egocentric me-music for spoilt upper-middle-class teenagers who think they're the most interesting people in the world.

Scabrous Birdseed
26-03-2009, 17:07:43
And that goes for both the early "tosser" period, and the later "wanker" period.

novacane
26-03-2009, 17:08:49
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Pulp if Jarvis Cocker wasn't fronting would be largely excellent.

that is the opposite of the truth.

Funko
26-03-2009, 17:10:10
I don't find it at all hard to see why people would dislike Radiohead.

Although I do like their early work.

protein
26-03-2009, 18:43:59
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Every single person who likes Radiohead is a complete whining twat. They're worse than all of the emo bands combined, sickeningly egocentric me-music for spoilt upper-middle-class teenagers who think they're the most interesting people in the world.

there you go with the lazy 'white middle class" thing.

Scabrous Birdseed
26-03-2009, 18:49:37
Are you denying it's music for people who feel they're entitled?

Lazarus and the Gimp
26-03-2009, 19:57:09
Originally posted by protein
people who say they don't like radiohead are lying.


You've got a point. If I was going to be totally honest I'd have to say that I really loathe the output of boss-eyed Thom and the whiney fuckers.

protein
26-03-2009, 20:15:51
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Are you denying it's music for people who feel they're entitled?
oh come on, you're not a complete prick, don't act like one.

Scabrous Birdseed
26-03-2009, 20:49:53
Look, I was bullied at school too, I don't feel a need to write two albums about how the world hates me, then depart from it in a giant shiny UFO powered by mental masturbation.

The Shaker
26-03-2009, 20:55:50
I like this weird thing called 'Music' which is lots of notes strung together in appealing way. Didn't realise it had so much to do with my sex, colour, wealth, height, age,or whether i was a vegetarian.

If analysing music to death makes you hate it, then why bother?

*End Is Forever*
26-03-2009, 20:58:05
I couldn't care less whether Radiohead felt they were entitled or not. It doesn't alter the fact that their music was tedious, with the exception of "Creep" which is an excellent song.

Lazarus and the Gimp
26-03-2009, 21:05:34
I think that "Paranoid Android" might have made it as a Queen b-side if they were really struggling with writer's block.

protein
26-03-2009, 21:10:33
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Look, I was bullied at school too, I don't feel a need to write two albums about how the world hates me, then depart from it in a giant shiny UFO powered by mental masturbation.
what have you written albums about?

Scabrous Birdseed
26-03-2009, 21:26:46
Nothing. That's kind of the point.

protein
26-03-2009, 22:36:04
i agree.

Scabrous Birdseed
26-03-2009, 22:37:05
Great. Let's shake hands and be on our merry way.

Funko
27-03-2009, 10:01:06
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Look, I was bullied at school too, I don't feel a need to write two albums about how the world hates me, then depart from it in a giant shiny UFO powered by mental masturbation.

You probably deal with it in different ways. There'd be nothing wrong with that if it was how you dealt with it though. If some teenager somewhere finds it comforting to listen to someone else talking about the same shit they're feeling then that's cool. Won't work for everyone but people are different.

People can only deal with their feelings about what has happened to them in their lives. It almost doesn't matter who you are, there are very few people where you couldn't say that other people have got it harder. So fuck it, you can only deal with your own issues or write about what you know.

People who've had a decent upbringing shouldn't be allowed to make music? Or if they do, they can't sing about what they feel about stuff? Ridiculous.

And if someone wants to write music about absolutely nothing, just for the joy of writing it, then that's cool too.

Gramercy Riffs
27-03-2009, 10:15:09
I think I hate a certain kind of Radiohead fan, rather than the band itself (Just is a great song). Mainly the fans who thought that they'd invented the wheel with Kid A. All they'd done is spent a year going through Warp Records back catalogue. That said, I do like Everything In It's Right Place.

Oasis had their moments, Pulp have probably aged the best of all of them, their 90's stuff still sounds good, Blur were good etc etc. I'll never forgive Supergrass for playing Caught By The Fuzz acoustic at Reading Festival. Acoustic?!!! Fuckers.

The best band to come from the 'Britpop' era (and they were distinctly and determinedly anti-Britpop at the time, only lumped in as they a) British and b) were on Creation) are SFA.

Scabrous Birdseed
27-03-2009, 10:29:50
Originally posted by Funko
You probably deal with it in different ways. There'd be nothing wrong with that if it was how you dealt with it though. If some teenager somewhere finds it comforting to listen to someone else talking about the same shit they're feeling then that's cool. Won't work for everyone but people are different.

People can only deal with their feelings about what has happened to them in their lives. It almost doesn't matter who you are, there are very few people where you couldn't say that other people have got it harder. So fuck it, you can only deal with your own issues or write about what you know.

People who've had a decent upbringing shouldn't be allowed to make music? Or if they do, they can't sing about what they feel about stuff? Ridiculous.

And if someone wants to write music about absolutely nothing, just for the joy of writing it, then that's cool too.

It's a dilemma because on the one hand you obviously want musicians who are true to what they believe and what they feel. On the other hand there are definitely things better dealt with through therapy.

I think I've mentioned before how I revile the journalistic notion that depression somehow equals authenticity, and that the music of depressed people (at least those who live out their depression through their music) is somehow truer. Having since experienced depression first-hand (and second-hand) I still feel its a significantly altered state, and far from "the real person" without the weird chemicals going around the brain, making it actually "less authentic" if that's what's interesting.

All this makes the entitled pretend depression of Radiohead even less interesting. Your rhetorical question about people who've had decent upbringings making music is probably justified, but the older I've got the more I've gravitated towards the music of the working class and minorities. It's liberating to hear musicians who don't think they're automatically great but actually have to achieve something first.

Funko
27-03-2009, 11:25:51
Who says middle class musicians think they are automatically great or think they don't have to achieve anything though?

I dunno where that's coming from, other than perhaps from your own personal prejudice. I just don't think it's true, or even if it is for some it's such an unfair generalisation to tar everyone with purely because of their background.

protein
27-03-2009, 11:49:45
I've gravitated towards the music of the working class and minorities. It's liberating to hear musicians who don't think they're automatically great but actually have to achieve something first.

is sweden stuck in the mid 70s?

i wonder if you actually don't have a musical ear and that's why you think the story behind the music is more important than the music.

give everyone on your street a piano and a tape recorder and the most talented or most determined ones will record the best tunes. although the blackest and poorest might come up with the best tune, it's not because they are black and poor.

i've lived in poverty for the last fifteen years and have no idea how that would positively affect the music i write. having working class and ethnic people in the band hasn't been a positive advantage. it hasn't affected the music at all.

scabby, get over yourself. stop rebelling against your parents and listen to music for what it is. without reading the back story. what music journalists present to you isn't anything like real life.

protein
27-03-2009, 11:51:29
here's britain's working class music. you'll love it.

http://www.vbs.tv/video.php?id=12185178001

Scabrous Birdseed
27-03-2009, 15:45:18
And unsurprisingly I do. :)

I'm totally not buying the idea that "the most talented musicians" will make the best music. If that was the case Frank Zappa would be better than Dharma (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZxLvd72xws), which is clearly not the case.

protein
27-03-2009, 16:06:51
you genuinely like donk music or you think the story of donk music is interesting? have you listened to more than one donk track? how does the actual music make you feel? would you listen to a whole donk album with headphones in a darkened room paying it your full attention?

comparing one colour artist to another colour artist isn't important. it's the music that's important. compare talvin singh to lou reed if you like.

personal taste is different from person to person, that's fine but are you really a class war racist that will disregard music because of the person who wrote it? if so, that's quite frankly sickening.

Funko
27-03-2009, 16:11:11
Seriously what's not to love about Donk?

Scabrous Birdseed
27-03-2009, 16:15:31
Originally posted by protein
you genuinely like donk music or you think the story of donk music is interesting? have you listened to more than one donk track? how does the actual music make you feel? would you listen to a whole donk album with headphones in a darkened room paying it your full attention?

Well, I've got a couple of bouncy/Scouse compilations and I've been looking for the more MC-driven material that appears in these videos. I think the genre shows promise, though not as much as, say, bassline did a couple of years ago. (It tends to be a bit too trancey for my liking, although the pulsating energy is fairly invigorating, a bit like the hardstyle/jumpstyle music from a couple of years ago.) It's still very much on the borderline of the kind of stuff I'd normally listen to, though. I might be working myself deeper into hardcore at some point, it seems interesting.

The other questions, frankly, seem a bit irrelevant. Does ANYONE listen to donk with headphones in a darkened room?

The Shaker
27-03-2009, 17:20:16
Going off the subject,
whilst trying to upload all my CDs onto my ipod I wouldn't bring myself to upload Lush, or Oasis, or Pulp or Blur for that matter. Despite that I wouldn't say any of the three are shit.
Hpwever I have uploaded all my Radiohead Albums and don't care who knows it. (ok only the first 3 albums I enjoy)

Hmm 'My life story', do they count as britpop? That's probably my naughty little secret.

Debaser
27-03-2009, 17:20:26
I think there's something about it in the Geneva Convention isn't there?

The Shaker
27-03-2009, 17:43:27
Yeah Geneva were good too.

protein
27-03-2009, 18:48:19
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Does ANYONE listen to donk with headphones in a darkened room?

the question is could anyone do it?

even the has-been trance producers behind this nonsense couldn't do it.

my racism question is still relevant though. do you think poor black artists write better music than middle class white artists?

Scabrous Birdseed
27-03-2009, 20:10:59
That's it, this discussion has become interesting enough for me to blog it. Maybe if you want to read that huge text mass (I don't blame you if you'd rather avoid it) you can continue replying there.

http://downwithtunes.blogspot.com/2009/03/humility.html

Originally posted by protein
do you think poor black artists write better music than middle class white artists?

Considering your "nonsense" comment, do you think the opposite?

Lazarus and the Gimp
27-03-2009, 21:08:45
I could have fun here pointing out epically pretentious musicians from non-privilleged backgrounds. Jon Anderson of Yes springs to mind.

protein
27-03-2009, 21:31:12
oh god, i can think of millions of awful white middle class bands. it's not because they are white though.

Walrus Feeder
28-03-2009, 00:03:13
There's a few of other bands that i recall too. Lush, Menswear and Northern Uproar. Not sure if anyone remembers them.

Looking back now Britpop did seem a bit overhyped but it seem a very productive period for British bands and there was defintely, in my opinion, better music and more talent on show than in the last year or two here. If there was more quality about now we might have never have heard of The Ting Tings!

protein
28-03-2009, 03:14:58
hey! they are friends of mine!

very rich friends now. so i guess they have the last laugh.

Gramercy Riffs
28-03-2009, 19:50:20
Is this that man and pretty girl combo?

MattHiggs
28-03-2009, 21:16:23
Was Britpop all shit?


No.

Lazarus and the Gimp
29-03-2009, 08:04:05
Originally posted by Walrus Feeder
There's a few of other bands that i recall too. Lush, Menswear and Northern Uproar. Not sure if anyone remembers them.




Lush were great around 1990-1992 when they were a cross between The Cocteau Twins and My Bloody Valentine. Then they went Britpop, and were rubbish.

Resource Consumer
30-03-2009, 23:04:02
Agree about Lush.

I actually like the Ting Tings apart from the name.

Turd
31-03-2009, 11:34:43
A thread about me?

Even us shits have music. Watch this video.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/484946/fart_music/

King_Ghidra
31-03-2009, 13:52:20
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Almost all of the music we think of as pretentious has been produced by people with a privileged background, simply because they feel it's their right to succeed, to make that masterpiece. They expect quality and and feel entitled to quality, and thus lack the humility that would prevent them from excess. Meanwhile, working class people don't feel that they automatically are allowed to succeed, and thus tend to produce music which is more functional, less personal, more professional

To express the counterpoint (pun etc.):

Who are these noble savages full of humility that you write about? Do they live in the magic kingdom?

The rap scene, to cite just one example, is saturated with people who are from shitty backgrounds but still have an expectation of entitlement as you described it earlier in this thread, and who have no concept of humility.

there has been as much self-absorbed, whining rap as there has indie (and again, rap is but one example)

*End Is Forever*
31-03-2009, 20:43:35
What KG said...

Lurker
31-03-2009, 21:02:27
True dat.

Scud Wallaby
31-03-2009, 21:46:23
Indeed

Scabrous Birdseed
31-03-2009, 21:58:52
Originally posted by King_Ghidra
To express the counterpoint (pun etc.):

Who are these noble savages full of humility that you write about? Do they live in the magic kingdom?

The rap scene, to cite just one example, is saturated with people who are from shitty backgrounds but still have an expectation of entitlement as you described it earlier in this thread, and who have no concept of humility.

there has been as much self-absorbed, whining rap as there has indie (and again, rap is but one example)

I'd think you'd be hard pressed to find a single successful (non-hipster) rap artist who hasn't reached that point through an extreme amount of hard work. The most successful rappers (Lil Wayne comes to mind) routinely write, record and mix down a track a day. You're also quite unlikely to find rappers who totally disregard their audience, or who're willing to record intentionally sloppy garage cack.

Someone like James Brown (to go for the ultimate example of an enormous-egoed black artist) was not just the Hardest Working Man etc., but an extreme control freak at every point of his operation. He'd oil everything to make it perfect, and had worked on his "self-absorbed" act for decades.

protein
31-03-2009, 22:28:06
you are so full of shit. i actually work in the music industry and work with/meet people from all sorts of backgrounds and different genres from different parts of the world. the ones that write good songs write good songs, the ones that don't, don't. it's as boring as that i'm afraid.

Lurker
31-03-2009, 23:05:10
Protein, you don't understand. The discussion has shifted to how hard you work, not your socioeconomic ethnic whatever stuff that was the original thesis.

Oh, and I guess Radiohead must have ignored its audience. I missed that.

Fistandantilus
01-04-2009, 00:08:46
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/5611/newoffice.jpg

For all you confused lot, this is an example of a hard working guy (and great singer).
Stop blahing and re-focus please.

MoSe
01-04-2009, 07:42:27
Elvis hairdo wannabe?

Funko
01-04-2009, 07:55:49
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
I'd think you'd be hard pressed to find a single successful (non-hipster) rap artist who hasn't reached that point through an extreme amount of hard work.

I think you'd be hard pressed to find a single successful white middle class artist writing about being bullied at school who hasn't reached that point through an extreme amount of hard work.

Indeed any successful artist, even the ones in manufactured pop bands.

King_Ghidra
01-04-2009, 08:07:18
Originally posted by Fistandantilus
For all you confused lot, this is an example of a hard working guy (and great singer).
Stop blahing and re-focus please.

:lol: :p

Provost Harrison
01-04-2009, 11:39:09
In reply to the original question, no, not all of it, but some hasn't fared too well. Oasis's output at the time still works well. Same applies to Pulp too. Blur, well, depends. Some very good tracks which still endure well. And then there's "The Great Escape"...to think this was considered a serious contender to "(What's The Story) Morning Glory"? Has anyone listened to that album after 1996. It was just too "Blur" for its own good...although I thought the following two albums to this were far more interesting.

Radiohead, yeah, The Bends was a good album...sometimes so was Pablo Honey...and I liked Paranoid Android from OK Computer but then they just went off on one, from which they haven't returned. I don't know what people see in their more modern cacophony.

I always had a bit of a soft spot for Shed Seven...not listened to them for years. Perhaps I could indulge in a bit of nostalgia this afternoon as I am working from home :lol:

Lazarus and the Gimp
01-04-2009, 16:17:58
Anyone remember the great Blur/Oasis race to number 1?

Chas'n'Dave v Staus Quo. Two completely unforgivable songs.

protein
01-04-2009, 17:02:43
i think that's what lead to dance music becoming so popular. everyone went all record decks and comedowns.

Lazarus and the Gimp
01-04-2009, 17:48:21
Uh? Acid House was 6 years earlier.

protein
01-04-2009, 18:02:52
really? i didn't know that.

you plum!

your average punter in the street, the music press, music in films etc started going all record bags and tribal house in about 1995 and started neglecting guitar music.

nirvana turned everything grunge, oasis turned everyone northern, blur turned everyone cockney and underworld turned everyone techno, drum and bass turned everyone drum and bass and music from the uk died for about five years until franz ferdinand, the strokes and bloc party turned everyone whatever they are.

Lazarus and the Gimp
01-04-2009, 19:27:45
Originally posted by protein

your average punter in the street, the music press, music in films etc started going all record bags and tribal house in about 1995 and started neglecting guitar music.



I was actually there, and that was definitely happening in 1988.

protein
01-04-2009, 20:35:42
so you represent the average punter now? i'm not talking about acid. i'm talking about the post oasis/blur period when it all went josh wink and chemical brothers and the sales of guitars were outstripped by the sales of record decks. apart from the first prodigy album, most kids were in the dark about dance.

look, you're probably just pretending to be dumb and i'm falling for it hook line and sinker because i'm way, way too tired and probably too stupid to tell when people are baiting me.

protein
01-04-2009, 20:52:12
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASF4gOWhN1c

Scabrous Birdseed
01-04-2009, 21:30:40
Actually in terms of UK chart success, dance music was probably at its most successful just before the Britpop era. 1991-1995 is full of big hardcore, eurocheese and dance hits. Although 1998-99 does provide strong competition.

Perhaps the best thing to say is different groups of "average punters" discovered the music at different times.

Lazarus and the Gimp
01-04-2009, 22:17:17
Originally posted by protein

look, you're probably just pretending to be dumb


Not in the slightest. I don't think you realise just how huge and mainstream Acid House/Rave was in the late 80's and early 90's. Castlemorton, anybody?

Oasis/Britpop actually dragged a lot back into rock. Go back 5-6 years from that and all the guitar bands were going Dance as a serious commercial move (The Beloved, The Shaman, The Soup Dragons et al).

Look, I realise you're a professional musician and all that, but ultimately you were a kid then, and you're trying to tell me that what I actually witnessed and experienced as a decidedly average adult wasn't what I (or the media at the time) thought it was. That's a tricky one to sell.

Provost Harrison
01-04-2009, 22:33:24
I remember the early 90s were very dance orientated with the exception of the odd bit of REM and U2...that kind of started to change a bit in 93 with Suede and of course the whole Blur/Oasis thing of 94, alongside stuff like Green Day or Offspring from the US...

protein
02-04-2009, 02:47:52
laz, did i say there wasn't dance before britpop? help me out here i think i'm going mad now.

possibly i'm so tired fucked up that i think i'm writing one thing and i end up writing something completely different or something so you'll have to bare with me if i am not making sense - but what i'm pretty sure i said was - and you'll have to forgive me because i can't even see straight right now - what i'm almost completely convinced that i wrote was - following the blur oasis britpop era there was a popular upsurge in dance music.

then i thought i wrote something about kids buying decks rather than guitars.

those points aren't a matter for discussion or a flippant point of conjecture, they are true. live music took a dive, clubs sprung up everywhere. people started wearing beige trousers, orange tops, carrying khaki record bags and had trainspotting posters on their walls.

by 1999/2000 it was very, very dance oriented in the uk. if you want to be purposely contrary then feel free but you can't argue with that fact because it's a fact. dance music hit it's popular peak in about 2000. it was pretty awful apart from all the ecstasy.

and that's not to say that guitar music wasn't around after britpop, it's just that acts like portishead, dj shadow, prodigy, chemical brothers, daft punk, grooverider, massive attack, underwold, fatboyslim were more prevelant than uk guitar bands and there was a huge upsurge in DIY underground techno, trance, drum'n'bass and house nights..

you are mistaken if you think that i am saying that dance music never existed beforehand. i'm pretty sure i never made that claim anyway. christ, even i've been making crap electronic music for nearly twenty years and i'm only thirty-one, i could tell you all about the birth of electronic music and could bore you to tears about the evolution of the technology involved. trust me, i had a two hour conversation with martin rushent about the development of midi and the production of "love and dancing" the other day and kept up with him just fine.

and bollocks to the "kid at the time" thing, although it was pretty late in the game, i did go to a squat party in about 1990 and while i wasn't driving around trying to find raves in fields at that time because i was thirteen, i was fully aware of what was going on.

Lazarus and the Gimp
02-04-2009, 05:10:46
What you said was....

i think that's what lead to dance music becoming so popular.


And what I replied with started out as a mild point about the fact that, viewed over the long term, Dance music in the mid-90's was actually in decline from the high point of the late 80's.

And ended up with me starting to get pretty narked about being told I was pretending to be dumb.

MoSe
02-04-2009, 08:10:33
Originally posted by protein
so you'll have to bare with me

are you going to strip together in some major sport event?

;)

Funko
02-04-2009, 08:31:36
Originally posted by Scabrous Birdseed
Actually in terms of UK chart success, dance music was probably at its most successful just before the Britpop era. 1991-1995 is full of big hardcore, eurocheese and dance hits. Although 1998-99 does provide strong competition.

Perhaps the best thing to say is different groups of "average punters" discovered the music at different times.

Yes, this. Exactly.

Sounds like Laz and Protein are having one of those arguments that's only possible on the internet, where they aren't really disagreeing but somehow it's still got heated.

Provost Harrison
02-04-2009, 08:47:57
"I agree with you"

"No, I agree with you"

"NO! I AGREE WITH YOU!!!"

etc, etc...

Funko
02-04-2009, 08:59:25
No, that's exactly what I meant! Are you being deliberately dumb?

Provost Harrison
02-04-2009, 10:11:36
NO! It's all completely effortless :p

protein
02-04-2009, 10:48:36
i'm not arguing. just clarifying. i genuinely thought laz was baiting me. i can't keep up with this internet arguing thing. i'm not sure when i'm supposed to start comparing people to nazis.

Funko
02-04-2009, 10:52:11
It's rarely a bad idea.

MoSe
02-04-2009, 10:54:57
you Britpop Nazis

protein
02-04-2009, 10:55:02
i was about to post a link to radio 2's definitive history of uk dance music and completely forgot that i was interviewed for the programme. that would have made me look even more like a dick.

but anyway, it's got the right terminology which i'm sure we can all agree on. the way they put it - in the mid 90s dance stopped being underground and started being big business. ministry of sound began to expand its empire - from clubs through to a record label, radio and TV stations. radio 1, which had ignored it, now had a variety of dance shows on offer.

Gramercy Riffs
02-04-2009, 12:03:01
You could argue that acid house actually began in 1986/7. But don't.

I would say though that dance stopped being underground in 90/91 if anything. Charly? Altern-8? Seseme's Treet? And the Chemical Brothers existed alongside Oasis/Blur etc (possibly pre if anything).

Anyway, I'm merely contributing as I find it an interesting topic, not to antagonise etc.

*End Is Forever*
02-04-2009, 12:35:01
Didn't Noel Gallagher record vocals for a Chemical Brothers songs once upon a time?

protein
02-04-2009, 12:53:19
it depends on your definition of underground. in the era i'm talking about, dance music was the main portion of alternative music unless you were into new metal, plus it was the main form of pop music.

from my recollection it was an era of nu metal, fatboy slim, steps, boyzone, armand van helden, mr oizo, the offspring, lou bega, vengaboys, rundmc vs jason nevins, aqua...

:vom:

protein
02-04-2009, 12:54:06
not to mention fucking garage music. :vom:

protein
02-04-2009, 12:57:46
oh and the manic street preachers, faithless and the stereophonics.

oh god, how terrible.

no wonder everyone was into drum and bass and techno.

Funko
02-04-2009, 13:16:27
Is this why The Strokes were so massive? Did an above average one-trick guitar band sound like rock gods after that load of old shit?

King_Ghidra
02-04-2009, 13:55:55
I can't have the manics dismissed out of hand without offering up The Holy Bible. Whatever people might think of them generally, that album is an absolutely brutal, honest, intellectual and musical triumph that does not deserve derision.

Anorexia, serial killers, The Holocaust and numerous other topics are dealth with in an incredibly personal and artistic style. This is not the same manics who released Ocean Spray and will stand the test of time far beyond much of the other shit from this era.

protein
02-04-2009, 14:01:05
wasn't that while they were young, exciting and mashed on amphetamines?

i'm talking about the 1999 manics when they were dull dirge.

King_Ghidra
02-04-2009, 14:07:00
yeah i'm, sure you were, that has sadly overtaken the band i used to like. the first album ,when richey was in full on 4 REAL arm carving madness was in 91 i think. holy bible was 94 when richey was in the priory and suffering from anorexia.

the manics most people now know is the one that made it big post-richey, as you describe

MOBIUS
03-04-2009, 13:49:37
Wow, you guys are way too musically intellectual for me to be able to make a meaningful contribution...:nervous:

Funko
03-04-2009, 14:12:08
That doesn't normally stop you. Arf.

King_Ghidra
03-04-2009, 15:40:45
a big boo for a missed c beast

MOBIUS
03-04-2009, 15:44:34
Damn! I expect they're pretty rare on the music forum...:(

Lazarus and the Gimp
03-04-2009, 16:32:17
Originally posted by protein
oh and the manic street preachers, faithless and the stereophonics.

oh god, how terrible.

no wonder everyone was into drum and bass and techno.

In fairness, that very same era saw the high points of Isolationist, a great time in Industrial, Trip-hop, and the real surge of alt-Country.

Walrus Feeder
03-04-2009, 18:39:00
The Trip Hop scene, Roni Size and Goldie. Where are they now?