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KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 02:31:00
Young black males think they're intimidating. White people think the young black males are intimidating too.

I just had the following conversation with two 15-16 year-old black males while filling up at a gas station on the border between my neighbourhood and the ghetto. Note that neither of them was taller than 5'8" or weighed more than 140 lbs:

"Give me 5 dollars" (rudely)
"No way, bitch"
"Watch your mouth or you'll end up on the news" (I'm assuming this meant that they were threatening to kill me, which is idiotic because murders don't usually make the nightly news here)
"Go try to scare somebody else. I'm not impressed"

(muttering to each other, then they walk away)

God, they didn't even try to back it up with threatening movements etc. But most of the white Americans I know would have been shitting their pants. They're inordinately frightened of black urban males. And those black urban males often try to take advantage of it.

:sleep:

RedFred
13-03-2008, 05:08:23
Still, I hate it when that happens. Last time two guys tried to intimidate me (both Asians) including one who punched me, I was stressed for days.

KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 05:35:36
Growing up in Montreal I didn't see either dynamic. Black males didn't seem predisposed to attempting to intimidate others, and white people weren't predisposed to being intimidated by them. Obviously there's a difference between blacks being a 6-7% minority population in Montreal and a 70% majority in Baltimore, but still. And it seems that even white Americans who grew up in suburbs where the only black people they were likely to encounter were middle-class suburbanites like themselves have this instinctive fear.

I don't get it. I watched American movies and American TV growing up. I was exposed to whatever unstated racism is in US culture. My childhood personal experiences with black people were probably identical to those of any suburbanite American.

Yet these same suburbanite Americans are (with very few exceptions) extremely frightened of young, urban black males. This attitude is near universal. The irrationality often extends to even somewhat-objective observations. Individual black men are seen as bigger and stronger than they are in reality.

I'm not even claiming that racism is more prevalent in the US than Canada. But racism against blacks in Canada seems generally focused on perceived stupidity/laziness. The fear element is missing.

This is something I noticed almost right away when I got here, and time has simply reinforced my view.

Vincent
13-03-2008, 06:54:27
What's your point?

zmama
13-03-2008, 06:57:14
gas stations are evil

Vincent
13-03-2008, 06:59:05
why so many werdz?

Funko
13-03-2008, 09:32:53
I think in the UK there's a similar fear of urban youths, but urban youths here tend to be in groups of mixed race.

Venom
13-03-2008, 11:55:13
Because they can get away with anything, that's why people are afraid of them. Because when you do see something on the news it's some black guy shooting some white person for their wallet.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/2568641/

Funko
13-03-2008, 11:59:27
If they can get away with anything why are 1/9th of young black men in prison?

MoSe
13-03-2008, 12:04:14
Originally posted by KrazyHorse
black urban males

hhhmmmm......

:gotit:

bums?

maroule
13-03-2008, 12:06:04
it's funny, white americans have always been afraid of blacks (even when they were is shackles), yet it's the blacks who have all the reasons to afraid of whites...

LoD
13-03-2008, 12:15:06
Originally posted by Funko
I think in the UK there's a similar fear of urban youths, but urban youths here tend to be in groups of mixed race.

Isn't that applicable to pretty much every urban setting worldwide? Except for the mixed race bit of course...

Funko
13-03-2008, 12:17:29
Well yeah, that was really my point. That maybe it's not the colour that's the problem.

LoD
13-03-2008, 12:24:23
Oh. Yes, definitely agree on that.

MDA
13-03-2008, 12:55:32
yeah, two urban white, hispanic, asian, whatever juvies hanging out at a gas station and eyeing me up would scare the shit out me too.

It really doesn't have a lot to do with race so much as the location. Your own skin color is no protection either if you look like you have any money. One of my coworker's husband was carjacked and taken to the ATM just a few weeks ago by a group of young Hispanic men (he's a Peruvian turned US citizen). He was jacked in the parking lot outside his home probably because he happened to be wearing a suit (he was returning from a job interview). His place happens to be a middle class neighborhood within convenient striking distance, on foot, from a low-income area.

The fuckers stabbed him in the thigh too.

Funko
13-03-2008, 13:12:51
Luckily in the US you can just shoot people hanging around like that if they scare you.

MDA
13-03-2008, 13:40:42
not in Maryland, too close to the capital

but otherwise, yeah!!!

Venom
13-03-2008, 14:10:32
Shit like that is why I need to get my concealed and carry permit. Some fucker comes and demands 5 bucks from me and then threatens to put me on the news, we'll see how tough he is with a gun in his face first.

KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 15:21:27
Originally posted by MDA
yeah, two urban white, hispanic, asian, whatever juvies hanging out at a gas station and eyeing me up would scare the shit out me too.

It really doesn't have a lot to do with race so much as the location. Your own skin color is no protection either if you look like you have any money. One of my coworker's husband was carjacked and taken to the ATM just a few weeks ago by a group of young Hispanic men (he's a Peruvian turned US citizen). He was jacked in the parking lot outside his home probably because he happened to be wearing a suit (he was returning from a job interview). His place happens to be a middle class neighborhood within convenient striking distance, on foot, from a low-income area.

The fuckers stabbed him in the thigh too.

Just to let you guys know, I'm not discussing the problem of crime in general, nor am I discussing the incidence of crime committed by blacks compared to that by other racial/ethnic groups.

My point is that I see a disproportionate fear of black males by whites and also a disproportionate confidence and willingness of black males to intimidate whites.

The point of my anecdote was NOT that two black males mildly threatened me; it's that THESE two black males (who were quite young, and not at all physically intimidating) threatened me and expected me to be intimidated. In addition to their negligible physical prowess, it seemed painfully obvious to me that they were playing at being thugs.

Funko
13-03-2008, 15:25:58
But I've seen or heard of very similar situation in England with the protagonists being white or asian and they expected the 'victim' to be intimidated too.

KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 15:26:06
Originally posted by Funko
I think in the UK there's a similar fear of urban youths, but urban youths here tend to be in groups of mixed race.

Actually, I was thinking about this this morning. The UK does seem hung up about chavs, hoodie thugs etc.

I should note here that urban areas in Canada are actually significantly safer than rural areas, while the pattern is reversed (and much stronger) in the US. What are the relevant figures for the UK?

maroule
13-03-2008, 15:29:47
you don't need to be big or visibly strong to be intimidating
their problem was that they were half baked amateurs

If it had been a short nervy guy with drugged induced crazy eyes and his hand in his pocket...

Funko
13-03-2008, 15:34:01
Hard to tell. Most police forces cover both and crime rates tend to be national or by force. The perception would be that urban is worse, but like the US if you live in a nice neighbourhood you're pretty safe even in the biggest cities.

The UK has 81% of people living in urban areas and, another 9% in small towns, so 10% in rural areas compared to 30% in Canada.

Funko
13-03-2008, 15:34:55
Originally posted by maroule
you don't need to be big or visibly strong to be intimidating
their problem was that they were half baked amateurs

If it had been a short nervy guy with drugged induced crazy eyes and his hand in his pocket...

That's KrazyHorse.

KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 15:46:02
You get more petty crime in Canadian cities than the surrounding rural areas. Maybe even more robberies. Definitely less murders and rapes. And the larger the city, the safer it is.

Vincent
13-03-2008, 16:06:33
I blame the niggers

KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 16:10:43
Good for you.

mr_B
13-03-2008, 16:11:45
but they can walk pretty pretty fast

Vincent
13-03-2008, 16:11:55
Yeah, whatever

mr_B
13-03-2008, 16:12:36
and they steal

mr_B
13-03-2008, 16:13:00
they don't say no to drugs

mr_B
13-03-2008, 16:13:23
and and and they like bill cosby

KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 16:13:25
According to Richard Nixon it's Hispanics who steal.

KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 16:13:48
Originally posted by mr_B
and and and they like bill cosby

Bill cosby doesn't like them though.

Vincent
13-03-2008, 16:14:14
And he's right

KrazyHorse
13-03-2008, 16:14:43
Tricky dick or the jello guy?

mr_B
13-03-2008, 16:14:50
for once

Vincent
13-03-2008, 16:15:37
mr_B

mr_B
13-03-2008, 16:17:29
huh????????

:nervous:


now breaks my wooden shoe

Vincent
13-03-2008, 16:18:05
you can say you to me

mr_B
13-03-2008, 16:19:37
you bist alles was ich habe

Funko
13-03-2008, 16:19:57
Originally posted by KrazyHorse
According to Richard Nixon it's Hispanics who steal.

Richard Nixon is a liar. - FACT!

mr_B
13-03-2008, 16:21:17
no he is not, he is an honest man, ask Alex P. Keaton

MDA
13-03-2008, 16:43:06
one of the things about rural areas that I lived in, that's different than where I live now was that everyone knew who the thugs were

they knew their names, their families, their neighbors... and when the thugs got out of line, they got put back in line by the above, whether the police were involved or not

there's less anonymity in sparsely populated areas, and I think people are just generally better behaved as a result of that

the biggest problems we had were kids breaking into hunting camps (some of which were nicer than my home) to party and trashing them, and tracking down little fields of weed and their local distribution points (usually gas stations and truck stops along I-80).

Funko
13-03-2008, 16:45:25
Your biggest problem was finding somewhere to buy weed?

MDA
13-03-2008, 16:59:21
pfft, if I'd wanted weed I probably could have grown my own

all I was trying to say was that anonymity + poverty seem like bigger factors than race - there, I said it better

I kinda got off topic though, since Krazy was talking more about how the perception that race is a factor seems to affect both victims and criminals behavior.

Funko
13-03-2008, 17:00:25
No, I agree but this being CG I couldn't stay entirely serious for that long.

Vincent
13-03-2008, 17:30:17
It's a crap topic anyway, but what about that weed thingy?

zmama
13-03-2008, 18:27:17
Ragweed makes me sneeze