PDA

View Full Version : War on Used CD-Sellers!


Dyl Ulenspiegel
08-05-2007, 11:09:12
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,131592-c,techrelatedlegislation/article.html

" NEW YORK (Billboard) - Independent merchants selling and buying used CDs across the United States say they are alarmed by stepped-up pawn-broker-related laws recently enacted in Florida and Utah and pending in Rhode Island and Wisconsin.

In Florida, the new legislation requires all stores buying second-hand merchandise for resale to apply for a permit and file security in the form of a $10,000 bond with the Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services. In addition, stores would be required to thumb-print customers selling used CDs, and acquire a copy of state-issued identity documents such as a driver's license. Furthermore, stores could issue only store credit -- not cash -- in exchange for traded CDs, and would be required to hold discs for 30 days before reselling them."

Now I was highly annoyed by the retarded US border control and visa procedures, but it is slight consolation that soon all residents there won't fare much better in their daily life. The only thing missing is an interview before granting a license to buy used CDs to fight the illegal combatants against the rent-seekers in the music industry.

LoD
08-05-2007, 12:44:00
A thumb-print? WTF!?

MoSe
08-05-2007, 12:45:10
it's "digital"

:nervous:

Bob
08-05-2007, 13:02:11
A driver license to sell CDs?

Drekkus
08-05-2007, 13:22:49
is it still allowed to sell old cd's on ebay?

So what is your opinion on collecting societies in the copyrightlevy area, Dyl?

Dyl Ulenspiegel
08-05-2007, 13:38:17
Short version: Fuck copyright.

Drekkus
08-05-2007, 13:56:48
Oh, and why is that? And would you prefer digital rights management over a levy system?

Dyl Ulenspiegel
08-05-2007, 14:08:05
No, I'd prefer free fair use. The whole thing is getting ridiculous when you try to enforce an IP right against a gigantic tide of copying possibilities. And the levy system is essentially a tax that funds a rather arbitrary handout.

MoSe
08-05-2007, 14:11:56
What's a levy system?
A market conspiracy led by jews??????

LoD
08-05-2007, 22:32:50
Dyl: why free?

Don't tell me you're one of the 2% of the Austrian population that support the KPOe :hmm:...

Drekkus
09-05-2007, 07:25:03
Originally posted by Dyl Ulenspiegel
No, I'd prefer free fair use. The whole thing is getting ridiculous when you try to enforce an IP right against a gigantic tide of copying possibilities. And the levy system is essentially a tax that funds a rather arbitrary handout. Yes, couldn't agree more. But what is 'fair' use? Could a copy protection, allowing you 5, or 10, or 15 copies, be fair?

Dyl Ulenspiegel
09-05-2007, 08:03:56
Originally posted by LoD
Dyl: why free?

Don't tell me you're one of the 2% of the Austrian population that support the KPOe :hmm:...

I'm so conservative that I consider IPR some of that modernist crap. :D

Seriously, why pay for small scale use like copying a few pages from a book?

Dyl Ulenspiegel
09-05-2007, 08:04:51
Originally posted by Drekkus
Yes, couldn't agree more. But what is 'fair' use? Could a copy protection, allowing you 5, or 10, or 15 copies, be fair?

Depends on the stuff. Software, music, books?

Funko
09-05-2007, 08:09:29
I agree with Dyl.

Bob
09-05-2007, 08:27:14
I agree with Dyl but disagree with Funko

Funko
09-05-2007, 08:33:31
I agree with that.

Bob
09-05-2007, 08:34:08
So does Dyl

Funko
09-05-2007, 08:35:55
No he doesn't.

Bob
09-05-2007, 08:38:55
I agree with that

MoSe
09-05-2007, 08:49:38
I must dissent

Bob
09-05-2007, 08:52:16
farewell then!

MoSe
09-05-2007, 08:54:10
I beg to differ

Drekkus
09-05-2007, 09:13:33
Originally posted by Dyl Ulenspiegel
Depends on the stuff. Software, music, books? Music. Is the current European law still sufficient, or should it (and can it) be made up to date to the current situation?

Dyl Ulenspiegel
09-05-2007, 09:23:46
I'd have to check the exact limits of fair use, but that should be free. In the end it's just a business problem. If the music industry wants to sell its products, it has to offer more than a simple copy that everyone can make in 2 seconds. The original has to come with a premium - how they do this is their problem.

Drekkus
09-05-2007, 13:45:59
Oh, how right you are.

Bob
09-05-2007, 13:52:37
Example?

MoSe
09-05-2007, 14:07:04
as right as heider

Drekkus
09-05-2007, 14:08:42
Originally posted by Bob
Example? Copyright!!

MoSe
09-05-2007, 14:12:46
good one!

we need a Copyright Copycat


---

I wasn't originally right, but now I'm copyright

Bob
09-05-2007, 14:18:24
You mean a copycat copyright

MoSe
09-05-2007, 14:24:55
didn't I already mention here my joke about the "index [finger] in the book" from that famous frame in the Copycat movie?

I claim Copyright on that!

Bob
09-05-2007, 14:27:26
I'm no expert on jokes.
Obviously you aren't either

MoSe
09-05-2007, 14:28:58
how can you say an expert if you're no expert yourself?

Bob
09-05-2007, 14:29:43
You don't have to be a doctor to see a skeleton is dead

MoSe
09-05-2007, 14:32:40
you don't need to be rich to be my girl,
but a skeleton is not dead - it never was alive! - the beast around it was

Bob
09-05-2007, 14:34:43
See, it's exactly the same with your humour!

MoSe
09-05-2007, 14:39:48
OK, you can be my girl

Bob
09-05-2007, 14:40:55
Finally!

Bob
09-05-2007, 14:41:55
all swell that ends well

MoSe
09-05-2007, 14:44:07
if you don't mind getting deflated when I don't need you
:cute:

Bob
09-05-2007, 14:44:54
Who needs me anyway. I could sell a few CDs in the meantime

Dyl Ulenspiegel
09-05-2007, 14:53:01
Originally posted by Bob
Example?

You mean "Link?"?

MoSe
09-05-2007, 14:54:38
According to the "Link by Example" policy

Dyl Ulenspiegel
09-05-2007, 16:27:39
You mean "Link by Example"(c) policy.

Funko
10-05-2007, 08:22:23
You should tackle this problem at source, stop the people selling new CDs and you stop people reselling them. But what about the CDs already in circulation I hear you cry?

MoSe
10-05-2007, 12:09:43
Originally posted by Dyl Ulenspiegel
You mean "Link by Example"(c) policy.

No, I mean the "Link by Example" policy.

MoSe
10-05-2007, 12:12:30
Originally posted by Funko
You should tackle this problem at source, stop the people selling new CDs and you stop people reselling them. But what about the CDs already in circulation I hear you cry?

a more radical solution would be making the whole humanity deaf at once.

besides, that way you won't even hear anyone cry

C.G.B. Spender
10-05-2007, 12:14:22
Good idea

Dyl Ulenspiegel
10-05-2007, 12:21:33
=(c)

Funko
10-05-2007, 12:29:36
Serious post

We were talking about this last night. I think the music is going through a bit of a fundamental change, they used to get most of their money through record sales, and live music/tours were used in a lot of cases as promotional tours to sell more records. Also the cost of making records was very high so you needed to sell a lot to make your money back.

These days, making records is relatively very cheap, people can achieve great results literally in their bedrooms for a few hundred pounds. Record sale income is declining and live music is becoming the major source of income, so we're seeing a bit of a fundamental switch from live music being the promotional tool to make money on records to records being the promotional tool to make money on live music and all associated merchandising. See some of the recent concerts we've had in the UK with the likes of Madonna charging over 100 a ticket etc.

C.G.B. Spender
10-05-2007, 12:32:18
25 years ago you could have had sex with her for 100 ! Several times!

Dyl Ulenspiegel
10-05-2007, 12:32:32
Yup. Every dying business model cries for subsidies first, and then it either reinvents itself or dies.

Dyl Ulenspiegel
10-05-2007, 12:33:04
Nice x-post

Scabrous Birdseed
10-05-2007, 13:21:50
The thing is though that we don't seem to be getting that big an increase in live music either - for a purely live-based revenue stream to work they really need to amp up demand for live concerts, and increasing ticket prices certainly isn't the way to do it. If they're gonna make it work, the music is going to have to change to reflect the new way of selling it, which would in effect be a reversal of the developments of the past twenty years - more organic skill-based music that works well live, less synthesized well-packaged pop songs. Or maybe something completely new?

In the history of music there has been plenty of ways earn money and if you look at each one you'll find music perfectly adopted to the revenue stream. Rock'n'Roll appeared once teenagers had enough money to buy records, and Bubblegum pop when children did. Heavy metal, with its dramatic imagery and male teenage audience, was the perfect vehicle to drive T-shirt sales. Reggae's contant development can at least partially be attributed to the demand for exclusive dubplates from soundsystems. Hindi pop music is cinematic because it is sold mainly via film soundtracks. Detroit-based music style Ghetto Tech works best as a soundtrack in strip clubs. And so on.

What the future holds for the music industry is uncertain but the very least we can assume is that whatever happens to the way music is sold, music will change along with it. American journalist Chris Anderson (http://web.archive.org/web/20041127085645/http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.10/tail.html), for instance, suggests that business revenue will become increasingly dependant on a very large multitude of highly niched, low-volume products, the statistical "long tail". So we're likely to see an increase in the prevalence of small obscure genres...

Dyl Ulenspiegel
10-05-2007, 13:28:19
"Detroit-based music style Ghetto Tech works best as a soundtrack in strip clubs."

Link?

Scabrous Birdseed
10-05-2007, 13:32:55
http://www.lyricsondemand.com/d/djassaultlyrics/assntittieslyrics.html

Scabrous Birdseed
10-05-2007, 13:33:55
http://www.ghettostrip.com (http://www.counterglow.com/forum/member2.php?s=&action=addlist&userlist=ignore&userid=404)

Funko
10-05-2007, 13:40:15
30 second tunes that loop perfectly for ring tones?

C.G.B. Spender
10-05-2007, 13:43:23
No, thank you.