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devilmunchkin
05-06-2006, 19:19:15
what ever woman needs to know to stay sane when living with a man
1)how do i get him to clean up after himself? (this applies to messes he makes in the kitchen after i've just cleaned it.)
2)how do i get him to get a better job/second job so i can stop paying for him. he ran out of money so he wants me to pay for his gas.
3)how do i get him to stop eating us out of house and home. I've tried eating less but he just keeps eating and eating. it's quite disgusting.

Koyaanisqatsi
05-06-2006, 19:20:46
Cut him off.

Qaj the Fuzzy Love Worm
05-06-2006, 19:26:08
1) If he doesn't you can't change him - FACT. Dump him and get a cleaner one.

2) If he doesn't want to you can't make him. If he wants a better job he'll make that an objective himself without your prompting. If you don't like that, dump him and get a richer boyfriend with a better job.

3) Wait until his metabolism changes as he approaches his mid-30's. He'll either cut back or turn into the Blob.


Unfortunately, these answers are much less tongue-in-cheek than they might appear, and far closer to the mark than may be comfortable. I apologize for this lapse into seriousness, and to make amends I now present for your amusement: a monkey on a bicycle!

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y193/lyramusic/MonkeyTrikeSodasmallllllllllllllll.jpg

Venom
05-06-2006, 19:29:33
Is that monkey wearing a jet pack?

devilmunchkin
05-06-2006, 19:35:22
no qaj. you're right. and i appreciate it.

he already is the blob. he's 205. i try so hard to compensate that i've lost weight and he eats fast food and gorges himself while i'm gone. i'm down to about 98.

How do i cut him off?

JM^3
05-06-2006, 19:37:50
Tell him that you think his ass looks fat.

Or make oblique comments about him ahving a double chin. Or something else. Just think like a man would in your situation.

Does he live with you then? It is harder to do things if you live with the person...

Jon Miller

JM^3
05-06-2006, 19:39:44
If you don't live with him (which is best unless you are engaged or married), you can just not invite him over as much.. and when you eat out, don't pay for the food.

JM

JM^3
05-06-2006, 19:41:18
Sorry, I see I did misread your first post (you do live with him).

Hmm, yeah, snide comments, that is the way. Make him feel uncomfortable with himself, make a point of looking at attractive, skinnier men who are walking nearby or on TV, etc.

Jon Miller

JM^3
05-06-2006, 19:43:04
Btw, the 2nd problem is especially some of the reason why it is best to not live a person unless you are engaged or married to them.

JM

mr_G
05-06-2006, 20:19:37
uh is this the same devil who said just some months ago: I stay away from men for at least half a year?

1)how do i get him to clean up after himself? well that's normal male behavior
2)he ran out of money so he wants me to pay for his gas. well Don't!!!
3)how do i get him to stop eating us out of house and home. put some venom is his food.

Venom
05-06-2006, 20:21:07
Harpoon him and sell his blubber to the Japs. That'll teach him a lesson.

mr_G
05-06-2006, 20:22:37
yup that's a proper solution....brilliant if i may say so.

Immortal Wombat
05-06-2006, 20:24:48
Solve all three problems at once: whenever he leaves the kitchen in a mess, cut a chunk of fat off him and add it to his meal.

mr_G
05-06-2006, 20:26:34
yep that's a proper solution....brilliant if i may say so.

DaShi
05-06-2006, 21:21:15
Emotionally castrate him so that he is just a shell of a man and exists only to serve you.

DaShi
05-06-2006, 21:21:43
Then dump him.

KrazyHorse@home
05-06-2006, 21:30:25
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
what ever woman needs to know to stay sane when living with a man
1)how do i get him to clean up after himself? (this applies to messes he makes in the kitchen after i've just cleaned it.)
2)how do i get him to get a better job/second job so i can stop paying for him. he ran out of money so he wants me to pay for his gas.
3)how do i get him to stop eating us out of house and home. I've tried eating less but he just keeps eating and eating. it's quite disgusting.

Errr....dump him.

KrazyHorse@home
05-06-2006, 21:32:19
Originally posted by JM^3
Btw, the 2nd problem is especially some of the reason why it is best to not live a person unless you are engaged or married to them.

JM

Why? If they were engaged or married then it would be even harder for her to get rid of his broke ass.

Qaj the Fuzzy Love Worm
05-06-2006, 21:41:13
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
no qaj. you're right. and i appreciate it.

he already is the blob. he's 205. i try so hard to compensate that i've lost weight and he eats fast food and gorges himself while i'm gone. i'm down to about 98.

How do i cut him off?

If your bank account is joint, open another one and have your paycheck deposited there instead. Solves much of 2 and 3, if he's been relying on your joint income for the fast food. Use a different PIN than your old one. Cancel joint credit cards, etc.

Chances are that'll cause enough angst he'll leave. If not, either move out and find your own place (if possible), or get a new boyfriend and have him move in. If your place is in both your names (rantal, purchase, whatever) that makes it difficult...

Oh god, well-meaning advice. I sound like Darkstar... So, now, midgets AND monkeys, together at last! At least, I think it's a monkey...

http://www.prima-ten-prints.com/midget%20meets%20digit%20small%20copy.jpg

Darkstar
05-06-2006, 22:09:36
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
what ever woman needs to know to stay sane when living with a man
1)how do i get him to clean up after himself? (this applies to messes he makes in the kitchen after i've just cleaned it.)
2)how do i get him to get a better job/second job so i can stop paying for him. he ran out of money so he wants me to pay for his gas.
3)how do i get him to stop eating us out of house and home. I've tried eating less but he just keeps eating and eating. it's quite disgusting.

Humm... Well, Qaj has been giving you good advice. The short answer is: Deal with it or dump his ass.

There are alternatives, but they all make you have to act like his mom. Is he worth that to you? I'm presuming you've already talked with him about this, and are left pulling out your hair at the total lack of change. So, with that presumption:

1) Nag his ass. Constantly.
* He doesn't sound like he gets how much this upsets you, or
* He doesn't care.
Either way, you nag him constantly. Just like a mom with a kid. He'll either tune you out, do what you want, or leave. You know, the same thing most people do when nagged.
2) Stop giving him money. Nag him about giving you money. Nag him about his fair share he owes, or will owe on the 5th, 15th, 25th, etc.
* By providing money, he'll just expect you to keep doing it.
* By reminding him of what he already owes, or is going to owe very soon, you are reminding him that money is an important thing in maintianing your current lifestyle. He'll hate hearing it, and will: tune you out and ignore you, may decide he should do something about it to shut you up, or decide you are a complete bitch he'd rather not spend any more time with and go hide from you.
3) Two options:
a) Nag him constantly, buy your own small fridge, keep your food in that, and get someone to put a good lock on it.
b) Start having "couples" exercises. Insist that he go on you with walks (to see the sights, make you feel safe, because you are worried he's a fat slob and won't be able to macho you properly, whatever) or join some amateur athletics clubs where you do a lot of doubles. Only by going with you will he get any: food, money, sex. You know, the normal couples things. Whether you two are a real couple or just living in the same place, if he is depending on you for money and food, he's vulnerable to the same leveraging as any other person.

Up to you. If this is just some random fellow you are sharing a place with, decide if you want to keep him around. If not, proceed on kicking him out or moving out (depending on who is the person on the lease). If you do want to keep him, you either accept the fat slob as is and put up with his ways or actively try to change him. Changing him won't be easy, and it won't work if you cannot find positive things to offer him for changing (ie, going out and exercising with you in exchange for stuffing his face or gas tank). People training is just like training any other animal. You've got to reward them when they do what you want them to do more of, and scold them when they don't. The scolding makes you feel better, the rewarding makes them understand they did something you like (and will reward them further if they do it again).

If this isn't some random fellow, but someone dear to your heart, you are left with the same choices. However, deciding to push matters risks more for you, as he may decide to leave rather then change, or do nothing, and let your frustration grows until it sours your relationship completely.

People can change, but its a rare thing for them to do so. You can change them, but don't expect you will. It takes a lot of practice to be able to lead people where you want them to go, and not all people can be led or retrained.

Ginfizwithatwist
05-06-2006, 22:30:27
Give him an ultimatum and stick to it
in the meantime, employ a little brinkmanship:
1)stop clearing up after him, leave all dishes until he runs out of crockery and cutlery ( keep a separate set for yourself if you eat at diff times and wash your own)
2) stop paying for everything, tell him you cannot sustain both of you and he needs to get a grip, as you refuse to go into debt for him. Tell him you cannot afford to run his car as well as your own, so will not be giving him any more petrol money, tell him he has to walk, ask work colleagues for a lift or get public transport etc
3) reduce what you buy at the supermarket down to the bare essentials- no frills stuff in small amounts and no junk/sweet treats, siting the lack of money has forced you to cut back severely.
Hopefully that should elicit a change of some sort- and if he doesn't like it tell him to sling his hook!

Darkstar
05-06-2006, 22:40:37
Ultimatums are always bad. If you are going to give an ultimatum, you are already playing at brinksmanship. That's what an ultimatum is. Do this or face this consequence. It's bad in that it communicates that you are willing to bargain, and this means that you aren't really firm on what you are showboating about.

If someone has upset you that much over something, just go ahead and start taking action to resolve the issue.

Now, we don't know if DM has already established rules with this gent. When you are co-habitating, you need to have the rules clearly set out. It's easier when you are just sharing a place to live, as you can sit down and establish them. When you are romantically involved, you tend to go through a lot more junk because you don't sit down and establish the ground rules for living together. You resolve them as you go along, slowly, as you go along, and that often leads to a lot more trouble in the relationship as you try and decide if its worth bothering to discuss the matter at all.

Qaj the Fuzzy Love Worm
05-06-2006, 22:55:06
Originally posted by Ginfizwithatwist
...sling his hook!

You know, I've only ever heard my dad use that phrase before :beer:

JM^3
05-06-2006, 22:57:10
Originally posted by KrazyHorse@home
Why? If they were engaged or married then it would be even harder for her to get rid of his broke ass.

Generally Money matters are discussed by that time in the relationship.

Or should be.

JM

Darkstar
05-06-2006, 23:11:23
JM, the always blind man trying to tell people how they should paint and with what colors.

Darkstar
05-06-2006, 23:13:08
Originally posted by Ginfizwithatwist
1)stop clearing up after him, leave all dishes until he runs out of crockery and cutlery ( keep a separate set for yourself if you eat at diff times and wash your own)

My girlfriend did this with her teenage son. Only took him six months to start washing his own dishes.

Paper plates are a great thing, she says. ;)

JM^3
05-06-2006, 23:15:30
Originally posted by Darkstar
JM, the always blind man trying to tell people how they should paint and with what colors.

I am well aware that the only reason I think so clearly about these things is that I am not involved.

JM

Koshko
05-06-2006, 23:57:51
1) Once a slob, always a slob. Just accept that you will have to nag him for the rest of your life.

2) Once an underachieving mooch, always an overachieving mooch. Just accept that you will have to nag him for the rest of your life.

3) Once a lazy fat bastard, always a lazy fat bastard. Just accept that you will have to nag him for the rest of your life.


Luckily for you women, you mastered the art of completely nagging a man for all of eternity. Unluckily for you women, men have mastered the ability to completely block out everything a woman says.

So in conclusion, just accept things how it is or dump his ass cuz it's never going to change.

Asher
06-06-2006, 00:02:43
Dump his ass.

Venom
06-06-2006, 02:51:16
HARPOON!!!!!!!

Scabrous Birdseed
06-06-2006, 07:11:53
Essentially these are all concience issues. Does he feel bad about doing these things? I certainly recognise myself in (1) and (2) and I feel fairly awful about it, and try to compensate. By doing as much other housework as I can for (1), all the cooking and much of the heavy cleaning mostly. And by cutting down my expenses to a bare minimum for (2).

Chris
06-06-2006, 07:34:22
Kick him in the balls.

mr_G
06-06-2006, 07:47:38
HARPOON him in the balls!!!

Tizzy
06-06-2006, 08:31:42
Nagging doesn't work - FACT.
And if you keep doing things for him, be it housework or paying for stuff, he'll keep letting you and nothing will ever change as he doesn't seem to notice/care that it annoys you.
Sit him down and talk to him and if that doesn't work you have some thinking to do about whether you want to keep him around.

And Qaj has a good point about bank accounts.

Diss
06-06-2006, 08:33:54
you have to pay him to fart? I lost you at this point.

MoSe
06-06-2006, 08:48:45
hhhmmm... only flipped thru the thread...
what escapes me, beyond all your more or less good advices...

I can't help asking myself, if THAT's the picture SHE makes of him, then WHY does DM live with such a guy?
IF dumping him was an option to her, then I figure she'd have found out by herself even before posting this thread.


So her questions are, how do I make him a tolerable housemate, provided that I DON'T want to dump him?
Maybe reflecting and reassessing WHY she seems to want to stick with the guy, can help her find the right perspective to tackle this issues with.

Sorry for this lame attempt at seriousness, and I don't even have any outrageously gorgeous pics like Qaj's!!!!
_____

and jes, I'm pretty much in the same JM's position, only sadder as I'm much older! :dribble:

Koyaanisqatsi
06-06-2006, 08:57:51
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
How do i cut him off?
Sorry, I didn't realize this was a Serious Threadİ.

In that case, I'll agree with the 'you can't change people' line of thought. The only options are to accept it as the price you pay for whatever positive aspect you see in him or to get rid of him. Liking part of a person doesn't really work.

If you feel like tilting at windmills, I'd suggest finding a way to make him think that changing his behavior is in his best interest, not yours. This rarely works unless you're dealing with somebody significantly less intelligent than yourself, or at least, less aware.

Colon
06-06-2006, 09:00:58
Usually sex is the effective tool to make a man behave the way you want.

Funko
06-06-2006, 09:01:42
:lol: Only if the way you want him to behave is to fall asleep.

Tizzy
06-06-2006, 09:02:52
Originally posted by Colon
Usually sex is the effective tool to make a man behave the way you want.

I've never understood women who do that - "if you don't do x you won't get laid" - surely that's just depriving yourself?

Koyaanisqatsi
06-06-2006, 09:04:43
Depends on the man.

Chris
06-06-2006, 09:59:39
Kick him in the balls.

Diss
06-06-2006, 10:08:26
Originally posted by Tizzy
I've never understood women who do that - "if you don't do x you won't get laid" - surely that's just depriving yourself?

because they know men would fall for it.

I would be resentful of a woman who did that to me. But I'd probably still fall for it. :). but I'd hate her for it as well.

So unless DM wants her man to hate her, I'd advise against that.

Drekkus
06-06-2006, 10:28:33
Enroll him to this course. It's in Dutch, but it will help him greatly.

AVONDCURSUS VOOR MANNEN

Alleen toegankelijk voor mannen!
Let op: vanwege de complexiteit en moeilijkheidsgraad van de lessen,
zal elke cursus maximaal 8 cursisten accepteren.
De cursus is verdeeld over 2 dagen en zal de volgende onderwerpen
omvatten:

DAG 1

HOE GEEF IK DE PLANTEN WATER
Stappenplan en diavoorstelling

TOILETROLLEN- GROEIEN ZE ZELF WEER AAN?
groepsdiscussie

VERSCHILLEN TUSSEN DE WASMAND EN DE VLOER Oefenen met verschillende
soorten wasmanden (visualisatietraining)

IS HET GENETISCH GEZIEN MOGELIJK STIL TE ZITTEN ALS ZIJ FILEPARKEERT?
Rij-simulator

DE AFSTANDSBEDIENING
De afstandsbediening loslaten: telefonische hulplijn en diverse
praatgroepen

HOE KAN JE DINGEN VINDEN
Training in het zoeken op de goede plek in plaats van schreeuwend het
hele huis overhoop te halen. Open forum



DAG 2

LEGE MELKPAKKEN: KOELKAST OF PRULLENBAK?
Groepsdiscussie en rollenspel

BLOEMEN MEEBRENGEN VOOR HAAR IS NIET SCHADELIJK VOOR JE
PowerPoint presentatie

ECHTE MANNEN VRAGEN DE WEG ALS ZE VERDWAALD ZIJN
Waargebeurd verhaal van de man die het eens probeerde

DE VAAT/ SERVIESGOED: VLIEGEN ZE ZELF NAAR HET AANRECHT/
AFWASMACHINE?
Debat met enkele experts

BASISVERSCHILLEN TUSSEN JE MOEDER EN JE PARTNER
Praktijkles en rollenspel

HET IDEALE WINKELMAATJE ZIJN
Ontspanningsoefeningen, meditatie en ademhalingstechnieken

BELANGRIJKE DATA ONTHOUDEN & BELLEN ALS JE LATER THUIS KOMT
Neem agenda/ PDA mee naar de cursus

LOSLATEN: ERMEE LEREN LEVEN DAT JE TOCH NOOIT GELIJK HEBT
Persoonlijke begeleiding mogelijk

Colon
06-06-2006, 10:41:23
:lol:

mr_G
06-06-2006, 11:10:07
:lol:

mr_G
06-06-2006, 11:11:40
so drekkus tell me, did you pass?

Drekkus
06-06-2006, 11:15:25
I'm still in denial about having to take it. Although it's very, very recognisable. :lol:

Colon
06-06-2006, 11:15:59
Why is nobody else laughing?

Drekkus
06-06-2006, 11:19:38
Maybe they're busy enrolling.

Chris
06-06-2006, 13:16:03
Forget all that, kick him in the balls.

paiktis22
06-06-2006, 13:26:16
twll him once. tell him twice. if he doesn't change dump him. he's fat anyway (200 must be a lot in kilos). unless he's good in bed, in that case you can try some more.
apart from that the fact that you don't have an inner urge to automatically pay for everything for him it means that you haven't bitten the sheet metal. meaning you don't have a crush on him. that means that you can easily dump him or if you think that you'd fall into an emotional void quit living with him and just meet for things that are fun.
2 euros please.

Greg W
06-06-2006, 13:30:44
I could be wrong DM, but it sounds like you already want to get rid of him, you just haven't worked up to doing so yet.

If there's one thing that I have learnt from 2 marriages and a few girlfriends between, it's that if you need to work hard to change someone, if the things they do really annoy you that much, then it's not worth it to try and change them. It's not worth the aggravation, the stress and the pain to do so.

Let them know that you have a problem, and that you want their behaviour to change. If it doesn't, then decide if they're worth the bad habits or not. Is it that annoying to you? Or is it something that you can live with?

Having said that, if it's someone you really care for, then giving up on them isn't easy. The natural instinct is to fight for them, cos you want them to be the best they can be, not for you, but for them. It's not selfish, but the problem is that if they don't want to change, then they'll resent you for it.

I don't believe in ultimatums. They just don't work most of the time, as you end up getting their back up. But have a talk with them about the issues, and how you feel about them. See what they say. If they blow you off, then it's probably not worth fighting over. Just move on.

It is tough, I know. The thought of being single, of not having that someone there for you is hard to deal with if you're into the routine with someone. But in the end, if you're not happy, you need to do whatever it takes to make you happy.

There is someone out there for you, it's just a question of whether you have the courage to go out and find them. :)

mr_G
06-06-2006, 13:44:47
dooooooooooooooooo di doooooooooooooooo

Chris
06-06-2006, 13:59:22
Forget all that stuff, kick him in the balls.

Colon
06-06-2006, 14:09:00
Forget that, blackmail him with sex.

mr_G
06-06-2006, 14:21:31
yep that's a proper solution....brilliant if i may say so.

Venom
06-06-2006, 14:23:39
No. You may not say so.

mr_G
06-06-2006, 14:24:58
stop me fat man!!!
stop me i say
stop me
stop meeeee!!

Venom
06-06-2006, 14:29:36
We need a height limit on the forum. You must be at least THIS tall to post here. Poor kleintje Pieter.

mr_G
06-06-2006, 14:32:53
:lol:

Chris
06-06-2006, 14:33:30
Kick mr G in the balls.

Tizzy
06-06-2006, 14:34:18
I'm sensing Chris has anger issues today

mr_G
06-06-2006, 14:35:11
Originally posted by Chris
Lick mr G in the balls. jes pleezzz

Colon
06-06-2006, 14:40:29
Blackmail MrG with sex.

mr_G
06-06-2006, 14:43:02
:lol:

Chris
06-06-2006, 14:52:33
Kick him harder.

Lurker the Second
06-06-2006, 15:01:18
Isn't this problem going to just disappear when you go off to school soon?

devilmunchkin
06-06-2006, 17:00:25
thanks everyone.

Mr_G: this is the same one i've been on the outs with. I haven't started my period of singleness yet.

Tizzy is right: Nagging doesn't work. I nag him all the time. I try to sit and rationally talk with him. I get kinda of an empty nodding and nothing changes.

Darkstar is right..ultimatums don't work. With a personality like his, he WILL do the exactly opposite.

Greg is right. I do want to get rid of him. I'm just trying to survive until the end of August when i move to Davis. I love him (granted not like he'd like me to) BUT this relationship is not healthy, productive,..and i can't support him when i go to college. I'll barely be able to feed myself. ANd i can't handle all of the emotional baggage.

I've still have alot of unsolved mental problems. And i can't get those fixed with him around.

I do live with him but we do not share accounts. I've just had to give him money or cover his share of the bills alot. I've told him he's fat...
and then i found out he did it on purpose. He says he didn't want to be attractive so he purposely got fat. Sounds kinda weird to me.

JM^3
06-06-2006, 18:03:49
Originally posted by Chris
Kick him harder.

You sound like a Dom..

JM

The Norks
06-06-2006, 18:55:42
DM, this sounds like more than just a few bad habits- its a clash of personalities and aspirations. On that basis I totally agree with Greg, cut your losses and before you get involved with someone else, try and picture what you need and want from a relationship. I don't mean whether someone scratches their bum or not, but their character, their lifestyle, their ambitions and beliefs etc. These are the things that make a relationship work or fail. Don't settle for less than you want or deserve!!!

devilmunchkin
06-06-2006, 18:58:15
i know. the extraction process is always meh..plus i would like to maintain a friendship with him.

JM^3
06-06-2006, 19:18:44
Just tell him you need some time alone...

He will probably take it badly, but what other way is there to take it? Might as well go for it. I thought you had already done so.

Jon Miller

JM^3
06-06-2006, 19:19:13
Either that or give him some guilt by saying that you can't afford him..

JM

The Norks
06-06-2006, 19:22:40
jon your relationship advice sucks!!

DM good luck!!!

JM^3
06-06-2006, 19:23:19
Of course, I have been in so many relationships...

JM

devilmunchkin
06-06-2006, 20:42:12
he knows..i've told him but it's kinda like when i try to talk to him other times. in one ear and out the other.

Darkstar
06-06-2006, 21:13:14
Originally posted by Tizzy
I've never understood women who do that - "if you don't do x you won't get laid" - surely that's just depriving yourself?

If he isn't very good, you aren't missing out, are you?

Besides, we haven't established this is a romantic relationship, have we? It could just be normal roomy stuff (like, the place is in his name, and she moved in to split the rent at a location that becomes affordable when two are paying, etc). Edit: I see we have--- never mind.

Darkstar
06-06-2006, 21:21:20
Well, you have your exit strategy. August. So, here's what I'd suggest, if you aren't going to jump earlier---

* Keep a minimum of food in the place. It will mean you need to shop ever day or two, but that will cut down on the food.
* Start spending all your time out. You are emotionally gone already, you just need the calendar to roll over to you exit date. Places that are cheap to hang out are: libraries, college facilities, church or charity groups, etc.

If he got fat "on purpose", he's got serious issues. I feel sorry for him, but not much. You sound like you've given it your best shot at being helpful, and he isn't wanting it. So don't feel bad. You did what you can.

self biased
06-06-2006, 22:18:06
i'd suggest moving another girl in and spend your time exclusively with her... but i know that's not an option.

devilmunchkin
06-06-2006, 22:22:46
you're only suggesting that because you want pictures....

self biased
06-06-2006, 22:25:50
100-0. it is my duty of having a Y chromosome to suggest such things, for the glory of all mankind. and think of how uncomfortable it would make him.

JM^3
06-06-2006, 22:28:04
That is what I was tihnking of when Self suggested it.

JM

devilmunchkin
06-06-2006, 22:32:49
i don't want to make him uncomfortable. i actually would like to stay friends. breaking his heart isn't something i'm keen on..he does still love me...

JM^3
06-06-2006, 22:38:50
hearts are made to be broken..

JM

Darkstar
06-06-2006, 22:39:44
If he loved you, he'd have more consideration of your feelings, because when you are unhappy or uncomfortable, he'd be less happy and more uncomfortable. Even if he was 4 years old, he'd still want you to be happy if he loved you, even if he couldn't remember in 5 minutes that slamming your bedroom door over and over and over again makes you unhappy.

Honestly, you make it sound lie he doesn't really care about you. That he is just using you, and strings you along whenever you need a show of affection. Or that if he cares for you, its in the same way a person cares for a useful object (like, say a car, or a computer, or their mobile phone), and not in the fashion that people love other living, feeling beings.

I presume he has some good traits, and we are only getting the dark, dull, uncaring bits. But it is how you describe it.

Darkstar
06-06-2006, 22:43:32
:tizzy: Hearts are not made to be broken. :tizzy:

But humans are tough and resilant, and they can deal with a bit of pain. Besides, I doubt this guy would miss DM, just what she's been doing for him. Otherwise, he'd be making some effort for her. Women talk about how the feel, guys show how the feel. He's showing indifference and that she's just a useful object in his life, not something he loves and values enough to take action to prove it.

DaShi
06-06-2006, 22:47:48
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
i know. the extraction process is always meh..plus i would like to maintain a friendship with him.

No, you don't. You just don't want to feel guilty about it. I tend to be a softie when it comes to breaking up as well. But once you do, you'll feel much better about it and be glad not to see him again. If you can still be friends, fine, but don't worry about it.

As for him saying that he got fat on purpose, that's complete BS. He sounds like a lazy git who doesn't want admit that he is one.

devilmunchkin
06-06-2006, 22:52:34
Sometimes I do wonder if he's used me more than he lets on. But i often think that no, it wasn't intention mooching, it was intentional laziness. And his way of doing things is all he ever knew. He had never been in a situation that had forced him to grow up. Yes, he does have some good traits. In fact, i would say he is the best person I've dated thus far by a long shot.

He is often indifferent but explains this by saying he doesn't show how he feels alot. I don't know if guys are like this.

And for the most part I would like to be his friend, but when he is ornery i can't wait to get rid of him. if that makes sense.

and yes, even i agree that the "i got fat on purpose" is baloney. And i tell him so.

JM^3
06-06-2006, 22:52:48
I look forward to my heart being broken one day.

Go for it!

Jon Miller

Diss
06-06-2006, 23:37:25
Ask here if guys don't know how they feel. Sometimes I feel like that, but in truth, I know exactly how I feel and don't want to admit it to myself.

He's probably not a bad guy, just lazy. That's probably not something you can change.

devilmunchkin
06-06-2006, 23:41:12
i think you're right. but his undue laziness has nearly driven me insane.

Darkstar: i just noticed the advice about staying apart. My mom had the same advice as well. And my car gets here tomorrow..... :D

KrazyHorse@home
07-06-2006, 00:25:45
If you care about shit being clean etc. and he doesn't then he's just not mature enough for you. I'm not even clse to a neat freak beuit I doefinitely don't appreciate aother people being slobs around me.

I'm glad you have an "exit strategy" as Darkie said.

Greg W
07-06-2006, 01:00:12
Originally posted by The Norks
On that basis I totally agree with GregThere's a worrying trend when first Tizzy and now Norks are agreeing with me on relationship advice. Maybe I'm actually a woman trapped in a man's body.

:gotit:
Just realised - if that's the case, there's no reason for my ex and I to have broken up. :lol:

Originally posted by devilmunchkin
In fact, i would say he is the best person I've dated thus far by a long shot.That's a bit of a worry dm. :(

It's funny, but I was listening to some talk on the radio the other day that most women prefer men who will dominate them in some way or another. They want strong, tough men, and not romantic men.

Not saying this is the case here, but I do wonder why that type of man is so attractive to women, and why so many women that I have met and dated recently seem to have such horror stories about ex boyfriends, and put up with them for a hell of a lot longer than I ever would. One woman put up with her husband at the time beating her up, sometimes daily, for at least a year. I don't know, I just don't understand how people put up with that from a partner.

Diss
07-06-2006, 01:14:54
yeah women are stupid. :)

Some women actually respect a man who is a slob and does nothing around the house versus a guy who would cave in and do things his wife/girlfriend asks them to do.

They seem to like men who don't give a fuck what their women want.

I just can't be that way, no matter how hard I try.

Qaj the Fuzzy Love Worm
07-06-2006, 02:34:33
Evolutionary psychology has a lot to answer for.



Darkstar: i just noticed the advice about staying apart. My mom had the same advice as well. And my car gets here tomorrow.....


There's a good reason why people advocate a "clean break" - often it gets messy without it. That's also why workplace relationships are generally a Bad Idea...

Diss
07-06-2006, 03:18:49
yeah I kind of know about workplace relationships. You pretty much have to quit to get a clean break. Kinda sucks. Oh well.

BigGameHunter
07-06-2006, 03:27:25
"It's not me, it's you."

devilmunchkin
07-06-2006, 05:19:57
Greg: yeah there has been a trend in the guys. Either I didn't see these qualities in them at first or some of them were just flat out liars. Hindsight is 20/20.

in the case of andre, he was only 19 when we got together so him really being a slob (i.e. hiding bags of trash when he forgot to take it out. rofl) and lazy wasn't an issue. until we lived together, i didn't see it.

mr_G
07-06-2006, 06:18:39
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
thanks everyone.

Mr_G: this is the same one i've been on the outs with. I haven't started my period of singleness yet.

harpoon him or doooo di dooooo what chris suggested.

Chris
07-06-2006, 06:20:24
What a bunch of crap.

Kick him in the balls, and he will comply.

mr_G
07-06-2006, 06:20:47
i agree with chris.

mr_G
07-06-2006, 06:22:11
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
And my car gets here tomorrow..... :D run over him.......twice.

MoSe
07-06-2006, 06:56:15
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
He says he didn't want to be attractive so he purposely got fat. Sounds kinda weird to me.

oh, that's easy

if you're fit, and you get rejected, it's your real self who got rejected
if you're fat and unattractive, you can always claim that you got rejected because the other wasn't able to get past your repulsive exteriority, but that's not a failure of your real self hiding inside

it's just that usually someone is unaware of doing THAT to himself - I didn't say that doing it on purpose it's normal, just that it's easily explained :D

Tizzy
07-06-2006, 08:29:13
dm, it's impossible to know if you'll stay friends with him after you split, it doesn't always work that way even with the best intentions. But one thing that is for sure is you'll be about a million times happier once you don't have to put up with him all the time. If you can survive till the end of August then go with that but my advice would be to make the break sooner. There's no point making yourself unhappy for longer.

Immortal Wombat
07-06-2006, 13:39:08
My friend's got a boyfriend man she hates that dick
She tells me every day
He wants more dinero just to stay at home
Well my friend
You gotta say:

I won't pay, I won't pay ya, no way
na, na, Why don't you get a job

self biased
07-06-2006, 15:20:12
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
i think you're right. but his undue laziness has nearly driven me insane.

Darkstar: i just noticed the advice about staying apart. My mom had the same advice as well. And my car gets here tomorrow..... :D

so you and your mother are on the ins again?

Gary
07-06-2006, 15:32:44
what ever woman needs to know to stay sane when living with a man

Same things one needs to know to stay sane when living with a woman, or those unsure for that matter.

Staying sane in the presence of others is an attitude of mind, for want of a better expression. If you can accept that others "live to the beat of a different drum" then you won't get uptight when they don't act as you want.

1)how do I get him to clean up after himself? (this applies to messes he makes in the kitchen after I've just cleaned it.)

You don't. Well not generally. You can ask of course, point out it's bugging you, but 'at the end of the day' it's you that wants it clean. The other wants to leave it messy until it gets sufficiently bad to spur them into action. You have different "tidy up" triggers. Accept or best of luck trying to find someone with the same triggers as yourself. (You may have better luck if you turn lesbian.)

2)how do I get him to get a better job/second job so I can stop paying for him. he ran out of money so he wants me to pay for his gas.

Probably you don't again. You can stop paying for him of course, you are no obligation to subsidise him. That's your choice. But it's up to him how much effort he feels he wants to put in to get a better paid job.

3)how do I get him to stop eating us out of house and home. I've tried eating less but he just keeps eating and eating. it's quite disgusting.

Again you don't. How much he eats is his choice,. How much you eat is yours. You can explain he's not earning enough to eat the way he does, but that's about it. Either accept or change the situation such that you are not subsidising him any more.


If this is getting to you more than you can cope with, then move on (or persuade him to).

devilmunchkin
07-06-2006, 16:03:04
Originally posted by self biased
so you and your mother are on the ins again?

Yes. She finished going all the way nuts and alienated all sides of the family to the point that nobody wanted anything to do with her. and she started writing me this bizarre letters.

as usual, i took pity on her (like i do everyone else) and offered to mediate and just talk to her. thus far, everyone seems to be alot happier. and some of the family (like my great-aunt) are actually wanting to talk to her again.

there is still alot of unfinished business between myself and my parents. i'm not sure if it will ever be addressed and i've made it known i will disappear again if they start with me.

____

I think i'm going to try to survive until august and also start nuding him along in finding his own place. he's got to anyway as i'm not taking him with me.

shagnasty
07-06-2006, 16:33:44
Kick him in the balls anyway. Just for the hell of it, and to shut Chris up of course. Go on, you'll feel better for it.

paiktis22
07-06-2006, 16:36:47
Originally posted by MoSe
oh, that's easy

if you're fit, and you get rejected, it's your real self who got rejected
if you're fat and unattractive, you can always claim that you got rejected because the other wasn't able to get past your repulsive exteriority, but that's not a failure of your real self hiding inside



it's like not studying for the exams in case you fail.

Lazarus and the Gimp
07-06-2006, 16:44:22
He's a lame duck. You've really got to put yourself first- you deserve a lot better.

self biased
07-06-2006, 17:20:01
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
there is still alot of unfinished business between myself and my parents. i'm not sure if it will ever be addressed and i've made it known i will disappear again if they start with me.

i told you it would just take time for this to happen, but stick to your guns and be firm. if you get more than an acceptable level of shit from her, do disappear for a while. there's no accounting for who someone is for the most part; you either accept who they are, or do not.

i'm glad things appear to more or less be taking an upswing turn for you. just keep your head for a few more weeks and you'll be able to start anew.

oh, and when specifically in august will things go down?

Chris
07-06-2006, 18:00:32
Too much talk, not enough kicking him in the balls.

The Norks
07-06-2006, 18:09:18
Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp
He's a lame duck. You've really got to put yourself first- you deserve a lot better.

yup- you cant fix a lame duck. You should shoot it and eat it instead! Go find a swan!

paiktis22
07-06-2006, 18:13:08
as a great person once said: it is better to use your time to find someone you agree with than waste it trying to change him/her

Chris
07-06-2006, 18:32:25
Still not enough balls kicking.

Darkstar
07-06-2006, 20:37:55
I've been enough bad places to know--- when you know what day you are leaving, it suddenly matters a helluva lot less to you. :)

Of course, if I wasn't such a moron, I wouldn't have been in as many of those bad places, but that's life.

Here's some advice on when you leave: Make sure you call up all the right people and get them to turn everything off! Otherwise, fat lazy slobs who never have money will often run the bills up in your name until they get shut off. Hell, I'd get the bills changed from your name to his name, RIGHT NOW. That way, you can make sure that when the new bills come in, they are in his name. This covers you so that you know they didn't call the places up the next day/week and convince the utilities/phone/cable/whatever that *your* moving plans have changed and you'll be staying for another 3 months. I've seen this done several times, so I think it's worth passing to you.

Diss
07-06-2006, 20:57:42
Originally posted by Chris
Still not enough balls kicking.

http://media.mnginteractive.com/media/paper234/20040323_CAL_M0323K01214.JPG

this was the first decent image I could find. Though it seems kind of strange, wonder what's going on there.

Chris
08-06-2006, 08:17:14
That was the pilot for 'Balls Fu' a cheap Kung Fu ripoff.

mr_G
08-06-2006, 08:20:29
me laaik cheap

Chris
08-06-2006, 08:34:02
It starred Huan Hung Luo.

self biased
08-06-2006, 14:11:10
Originally posted by Darkstar
Here's some advice on when you leave: Make sure you call up all the right people and get them to turn everything off! Otherwise, fat lazy slobs who never have money will often run the bills up in your name until they get shut off. Hell, I'd get the bills changed from your name to his name, RIGHT NOW. That way, you can make sure that when the new bills come in, they are in his name. This covers you so that you know they didn't call the places up the next day/week and convince the utilities/phone/cable/whatever that *your* moving plans have changed and you'll be staying for another 3 months. I've seen this done several times, so I think it's worth passing to you.

eight thousand qweegles. remember what my sister and brother-in-law did to me.

Darkstar
08-06-2006, 22:47:14
So, you've had that personally happen? Sorry to hear it.

Woman can just so easily social hack, it isn't funny.

self biased
09-06-2006, 04:44:11
i wasn't going to be the ogre and shut the power off with a newborn in the house. worse came to worse, and now i owe the local power company fifteen hundred dollars.

JM^3
09-06-2006, 04:44:59
change your name to Akbar and start wearing a turbin...

JM

devilmunchkin
09-06-2006, 05:52:17
yeah but at the time i'd argue you had it coming, chris. *shakes finger*

well..family is here and he's behaving like an angel. my mom said she almost questioned whether i was telling the truth. i actually like being around him but i tell myself this isn't permanent. he will be an ass again after they leave. i believe he will be moving out as well since he cannot afford the rent on his own. he can barely afford his half on this place

KrazyHorse@home
09-06-2006, 06:02:41
Make sure the landlord gets a letter from you indicating your intention to vacate the premises, and that he has your new address to send you your half of the security deposit.

self biased
09-06-2006, 06:08:06
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
yeah but at the time i'd argue you had it coming, chris. *shakes finger*

yes, i was a big softee with no backbone. i knew it then, but didn't know how to stand up for myself at the time.

oh, and an interesting fact to note, there's a third added to the clan. bobby, billy, and now benjamin.

Colon
09-06-2006, 07:37:42
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
yeah but at the time i'd argue you had it coming, chris. *shakes finger*

well..family is here and he's behaving like an angel. my mom said she almost questioned whether i was telling the truth. i actually like being around him but i tell myself this isn't permanent. he will be an ass again after they leave. i believe he will be moving out as well since he cannot afford the rent on his own. he can barely afford his half on this place

What a hypocritical prick. If I were you I'd throw him out regardless. For the sake of principle.

Oerdin
09-06-2006, 14:20:31
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
what ever woman needs to know to stay sane when living with a man
1)how do i get him to clean up after himself? (this applies to messes he makes in the kitchen after i've just cleaned it.)
2)how do i get him to get a better job/second job so i can stop paying for him. he ran out of money so he wants me to pay for his gas.
3)how do i get him to stop eating us out of house and home. I've tried eating less but he just keeps eating and eating. it's quite disgusting.

#1 may apply but the other two don't apply to most men. Most of us pay our own way and your ex just had an issue with #3.

Chris
09-06-2006, 14:54:24
Blah blah blah.

Kick him in the balls.

Colon
09-06-2006, 17:07:25
Yeah, kick him in the balls.

Darkstar
09-06-2006, 18:25:49
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
well..family is here and he's behaving like an angel. my mom said she almost questioned whether i was telling the truth. i actually like being around him but i tell myself this isn't permanent. he will be an ass again after they leave. i believe he will be moving out as well since he cannot afford the rent on his own. he can barely afford his half on this place

Proves he's full of it. If he was a real lazy bastard, he still be the same lazy bastard. Behaving means he doesn't care about you nor what you think, but does care what your family thinks.

Darkstar
09-06-2006, 18:35:55
Originally posted by self biased
i wasn't going to be the ogre and shut the power off with a newborn in the house. worse came to worse, and now i owe the local power company fifteen hundred dollars.

Phone company is worse.

I've moved into a couple of places where the phone company had outstanding debts from the previous renters. They decided that I couldn't have a phone until that bill for that wire service was paid off, despite an 8 week break between the previous renters and myself taking over the line.

I told them to fuck off, and never got a landline phone. I know that when I moved out of that apartment, and the next renters came in, that the phone company did the same thing to them. And the baby bells wonder why people want to desert them for other providers!

I did have an outstanding debt of $40 to the phone company myself. When I moved into my new apartment following the one with the huge debt, the phone company reminded me of that debt to them. After determining that the last final payment I sent them got lost in the mail-- as the check never got cashed--- I paid that and they actually got around to hooking up that apartment's land line.

devilmunchkin
07-07-2006, 16:29:45
update:
things went from bad to worse. He's not handling this breakup well at all. I am debating on moving early even though i need the money. We're at that point in the breakup where you've been around each other too long and it's past time to have moved away from each other. I'm not the hated and despised one.

Chris
07-07-2006, 16:39:49
You should have kicked him in the balls.

devilmunchkin
07-07-2006, 17:00:42
i might not be alive right now if i did that. :)

Lazarus and the Gimp
07-07-2006, 18:23:33
If you can afford my air fare, I'll kick him in the balls for you. I travel Club Class.

Greg W
08-07-2006, 01:01:57
Frankly, I don't know how you've stayed with him this long if things are that bad. Money is one thing - happiness is much more important.

devilmunchkin
08-07-2006, 11:47:53
how is it that over night he's possibly found a place to live. he had such a hard time before....i think my mother was right and he was stalling.
it's possible he may start moving out this week.
i just think it sucks i'm going to probably loose a friend. i've actually cried quite a bit..i think he feels a little guilty.

Gibsie
08-07-2006, 11:59:49
Sounds like a muppet. Get a kitten instead.

devilmunchkin
08-07-2006, 12:24:38
been thinking about it

Chris
08-07-2006, 13:53:40
As he leaves, kick him in the balls.

Colon
08-07-2006, 14:43:40
Yeah, kick him in the balls. And thrust a scissor in his back as he reaches for them.

Greg W
09-07-2006, 00:38:24
It's always hard staying friends if only one person wants the break-up. Good luck with it though.

self biased
11-07-2006, 13:27:03
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
been thinking about it

i have some baby rats if you're interested. they're cute and super friendly.

mr_G
11-07-2006, 13:33:09
kick him gently in the balls, twice.
and hey he should feel guilty

devilmunchkin
11-07-2006, 15:51:00
he's not going to feel guilty about anything if he's angry and broken hearted. if anything, he's trying (and succeeding because it's not a hard task) to make me feel guilty about hurting him (despite my intentions).

JM^3
11-07-2006, 15:55:00
When relationships end people feel hurt. If no one feels hurt, then it was a sucky relationship.

JM

devilmunchkin
11-07-2006, 17:04:37
true. i'm writing a poem on that.

Colon
11-07-2006, 22:05:29
Originally posted by JM^3
When relationships end people feel hurt. If no one feels hurt, then it was a sucky relationship.

JM

Depends on how steamy the sex was, really.

Greg W
12-07-2006, 00:40:43
Just remember DM, you haven't done anything wrong. Well, from what you've told us anyway - and I don't think you're the type to do so anyway. He probably is hurting right now, and unfortunately, some men (and women) turn that into being nasty back at the person that hurt them.

Logic and reasoning don't come into it, it's just a test of just how nice a person you really are. Unfortunately from the sounds of it, he's failing the test, and I feel for you, it can't be fun. *hug*

devilmunchkin
12-07-2006, 17:42:52
i keep telling myself that. But after hearing the opposite for awhile, you start to wonder. YOu feel programed and you wonder how on earth there

could have been such huge miscommunication. I've been doing something that i can't quite help, I've been being overly nice and catering to him. Been going out of my way to do so. I know that it is a sign of weakness. I know alot of women who do this. Their guy gets upset and they try so hard to make everything better.

There is a giant empty hole in me because i realize that somebody important to me (as a friend) is exiting my life. It's a very sad, heartbreaking situation. Perhaps I am less of a person for it. yesterday was the first day I didn't break down in tears. I'm just not handling it all well. I'm probably going to see a therapist once i move and continue on my meds. I didn't want to before , but my inability to deal with this and any stress is getting intolerable.

mr_G
13-07-2006, 13:55:54
therapists are kewl :bounce::bounce:
mine was soooooo good.

Nills Lagerbaak
13-07-2006, 14:26:33
Hang on a minute did anyone else not find this odd?

Mr. G is the insanest person in the world. His therapist should be fired / hailed as a God.
:p

Tizzy
13-07-2006, 14:30:54
He used to be more insane.

Scary, huh.

Nills Lagerbaak
13-07-2006, 14:40:37
genuinely scary.

Mr. Bas
13-07-2006, 14:51:04
Trust your mechanic to rip you off.

mr_G
15-07-2006, 10:13:20
time to loose the bunny

Chris
15-07-2006, 10:18:12
I am mr G's therapist.

The little monkey is fine.

paiktis22
15-07-2006, 11:03:29
Originally posted by devilmunchkin
i keep telling myself that. But after hearing the opposite for awhile, you start to wonder. YOu feel programed and you wonder how on earth there

could have been such huge miscommunication. I've been doing something that i can't quite help, I've been being overly nice and catering to him. Been going out of my way to do so. I know that it is a sign of weakness. I know alot of women who do this. Their guy gets upset and they try so hard to make everything better.

There is a giant empty hole in me because i realize that somebody important to me (as a friend) is exiting my life. It's a very sad, heartbreaking situation. Perhaps I am less of a person for it. yesterday was the first day I didn't break down in tears. I'm just not handling it all well. I'm probably going to see a therapist once i move and continue on my meds. I didn't want to before , but my inability to deal with this and any stress is getting intolerable.


the "women become clowns" situation. not judging, not saying i'm the pope. every situation is different etc etc. But I have to ask, although I know the answer (maybe i am the pope). When you go out of your way to please him, don't you feel you cheated yourself?

Greg W
15-07-2006, 13:19:41
Ah, if only you could put old heads on young shoulders...

...I suppose you'd end up with some very rough headed people with great bodies.

It's always easy to say from the sidelines, but a relationship should be a two way street. Both partners giving to each other, according to their needs and wants. Anything less is, well, IMNSHO, a waste of time. Heck, friendships should be the same too.

I could be wrong (normally am in fact), but I think you need some major confidence dm. I think you know that you're in the right, but you're not confident enough to back your judgement. I'll be blunt here. This bloke sounds like a selfish pig. Allright, it may not be his decision to split, but it is his decision to act like a child about it.

And you're (unwittingly) exaserbating matters by being too nice to him. And it's quite possible that it's because you're being too nice to him that he cannot (or will not) respect you. Could be misreading things here, cos I ain't no psychologist, and I don't know the two of you, but this could be the case.

As much as losing a friend might be painful, I think that prolonging this is even more painful for you. If you had've made a clean break months ago, you could have had a few months of being down in the dumps, and you'd be on your way back up now. But by prolonging it, you're just making things worse for yourself.

And don't get me wrong, I don't blame you, it's always hard when you're in the middle of things, and it's always easier to see from the outside. And making (il)logical assumptions and reasonings from the safety of thousands of kilometers away is even easier again. ;)

Ask yourself this. From the way he has acted, do you really want him as a friend? What do you see yourself gaining from this friendship? Or is it possibly just the fact that you feel guilty about the situation that you want to make it up to him by remaining friends. Sorry, I just don't see why you'd want to remain friends, he gives you nothing other than misery.

Sorry if that's a bit blunt, just trying to maybe point out a few things that may not be so obvious to you...

devilmunchkin
15-07-2006, 14:13:33
A glimmer of hope that i will see the old andre..the andre who used to make me laugh and would listen and give good advice and we were friends.

And yes, you're right i'm making matters worse. WHen i'm able to keep myself composed i reflect on it, i see me as some weak willed women. Disgraceful even (hope that answers your question paiktis).

he's starting to move august 1st...so i think part of me is treating it like "this is it. have to make this remaining time count" because after that he's gone. And that doesn't make it right. It just reinforces bad habits that i have.

I don't know where to pull confidence from and i don't know how to exude it. Just like i don't know how to relax.

talking to a friend right now...he says if i'm catering to him, would the friendship count as much knowing i'd bribed him back into it? would it be the same. And i suppose the answer is no.

So then the next question: how do stop catering? where do i begin? How do i change this part of me that fear abandonment? How do i cope in the here and now so as to not create a war but not to encourage his behavior?

paiktis22
15-07-2006, 14:51:56
Am I reading my own thoughts of long ago?! I guess I was more banal that I thought. Taking a conscious distance from my usually liberal all tolerant non interference attitude I will offer advice. I take the liberty to do it because it was like I've just heard myself of some time ago speak.

First it's not him or the relationship you're fighting. You're fighting you. The more you remain untruthful to what you really want to do and say the more your own self will punish you. Say what's on your mind directly to him. Do not try to "play nice" because the relationship is at its final days. You'll hate yourself for it later on. Remain true to yourself even to the last split minute. Say what's on your mind. He'll agree or not, doesn't matter. Don't try to cuddle him/ "buy" him back. You will not be doing yourself a favor.

And of course, it's hard to see a deep relationship that sometime ago had mutual understanding/feeling being dissolved. You might even feel that you won't find it again or that it would be difficult to find it. Maybe also that it has all become fake and that if after what you've shared, you still break up then what's the point in trying to find that again, it all becomes a big lie.

However it is not so. You're young you're beautiful and smart it's up to you to be with someone who will really care and you will care for him too. Don't "close" yourself. The more open you remain the more chances you'll have to be with someone that will want to be with the real you. Don't try to satisfy others. It's not how it works. You'll give the wrong signals and actually manufacture a "platform" for "failure". Because the platform will be standing on fake legs. Show what you really are and what you really want. If you get "dumped" then you got "dumped" because the other one doesn't click with you and it's nobody's fault. We are not all the same. Accept what you are and show it outward to the world. When someone approachs you he will approach you for exactly it. And the chances are much better that you will be happy together.

If you try to not do what you want/say what you want in the vague hope that this might change the directions things are going, you are going the wrong direction! And yourself will not be too pleased with you either. Might reward you with stress and definitely low confidence. You don't respect yourself why should it respect you.

And finally although you might now go back and remember how good it was at the beggining don't think that this sort of feeling can't come again. And this time it might even be with the right person. And it is all up to you and nobody else. You are open and free about what you want and are and the crowd will follow. And some of it won't. But in no circumstance is it healthy to let yourself be judged based on how others, in some particular time, judge you.

If you do all that and that relationship continues, great. If it doesn't there are a looot of orange trees out there who make oranges :D And your kind of oranges.

Anyway that was my small contribution. Hope it helped a bit.

Colon
15-07-2006, 15:20:49
Originally posted by paiktis22

Anyway that was my small contribution.

You're such a liar.

Greg W
16-07-2006, 00:32:59
What Patikis said.

In the end, it comes down to being true to yourself. Knowing yourself, your faults, your good points, your needs and your desires from a relationship. Really, truly, believing that you are a good person, and that you deserve someone else who's also good, both to you and in general from your perspective. Someone who you rely on, and relies on you, but not as a crutch, more as an equal partnership.

But first and foremost, you need to value you for who you are. And that can be very hard, especially for people with low confidence levels. I'm not sure that I can tell you how to get it, I've never been in quite the situation that you're in, but I do know that it won't happen overnight. It's not just a switch that you can flick, and suddenly you are confident in yourself. But one thing that does help breed that confidence is in doing the right thing.

In this situation, that means realising what is right for you, and doing it in such a way that you're comfortable with, and that you believe is right. You're starting to do this, and have made good progress with finally kicking him out. But you should also look back now and reflect on what you've done wrong, and perhaps how you could have done better.

In saying that, I think that you should also realise that in the end, the only person you've really donw wrong by is yourself. You've treated him far better than he deserves from the sounds of it, and in doing so, you've let him walk all over yourself. And while your actions come from a desire to do the right thing by him, in the end you need to see that you're doing the opposite. You're hurting yourself, and causing him to lose respect for you.

If you valued yourself higher than you do now, that wouldn't happen.

As I said, I can't help you to value yourself. It's something that your friends and family can help with. Talk to them about this. Find a good friend or family member who you trust totally, and tell them about your lack of confidence, your apparent low self esteem or low self value, and if they're a good enough friend - which is why you have to choose well - then they'll help the process somewhat.

After all, there's only so much a Greek and an Aussie can do to help you out from thousands of kms away. :)

In the end though, learn to like yourself, faults and all. Learn to value yourself. And once you like yourself, and place a high enough value on yourself, then find someone who will, in the long term, place an equally high value on you.

devilmunchkin
17-07-2006, 05:35:18
i want to thank you all for helping me. In the end, you're not telling me anything i don't know deep down. My only issue is how to implement all of this. How do i let go...that is an issue i've always had.

I know i need to let go but when i get to thinking about it, you think "i can't imagine my life any other way.' i bet i will get even a year down the road and think i made a bigger issue out of it than it was. I won't be able to imagine my life the way it is now. It's just getting there and i never see the steps. It just happens.

mr_G
17-07-2006, 06:43:34
it's only human to be afraid of changes.

Greg W
17-07-2006, 10:11:25
And to be afraid of being alone. Of needing to start again. Of losing a friend.

And there's also a difference between knowing something, and believing it.

How to implement change? That's always the toughest part. And it's only something you learn from experience. Just make sure that you learn form this, and don't just look back and regret everything and see no positives from it. If you don't learn from this, then that would be the biggest tragedy.

And no worries about the help. Some CGers did it for me once, so you're more than welcome.

mr_G
17-07-2006, 10:12:05
Originally posted by Greg W
[B]And to be afraid of being alone. Of needing to start again. Of losing a friend.
/B] jesjes changes

devilmunchkin
17-07-2006, 18:20:30
i try to learn from each relationship i've had. This was my longest lasting one. We lasted over 3 years. my life will be completely and utterly changing..moving, going back to school, he's not going with me. Very little will be the same.

I don't think it's the being alone part that scares me. It's not having HIM there after being so used to having him around. ANd it's not like i don't care or don't love him. I do..but...

and i just noticed i have a strange bruise in the center of my right palm. odd.

thank you guys for being here for me. it really means alot. i really look up to the lot of you.

Japher
17-07-2006, 18:23:26
it's not like i don't care or don't love him. I do..but...


but what?

whatever...

My dog, Buddy, follows me everywhere. A lot of times I stop short, make quick turns, or go somewhere where I need to hold the door or security gate open for her. When she's not with me I still do it, or look out for her, it feels like she's still there.

I think you treated your boyfriend like a dog

devilmunchkin
17-07-2006, 18:30:28
i do but being with him is not healthy. I shouldn't have to play lover, friend, and mom. I shouldn't have to be the memory for 2 people. He needs to get on his feet and grow up. He can't do that if i'm there. And if i'm there and he falls, then we're both affected. That's the "but"

you think i treated him like a dog in the fact that i metaphorically held the gate open ..or i treated him like a dog in that i treated him like dirt?

Japher
17-07-2006, 18:32:58
not that you treated him like dirt

more so like what you explained in the first paragraph of the post above

that's a pretty big "but"
you should have to use "tough love" on your mate, that's generally reserved for children

devilmunchkin
17-07-2006, 18:35:16
i know.. :(

and i don't think this is something that will ever be fixed. unless he made some drastic changes and my mind could accept that.

but probably the best bet is for me to try and move on...try to at least...

i'm beginning this self help book my psychiatrist recommended...never read a self help book before because i always heard they didn't work.

Japher
17-07-2006, 18:40:24
I like self help books. The give you time to contemplate and reflect. IMO, the best thing to do after coming out of a long relationship (whether you came out on good or bad terms) is to spend sometime finding yourself again. Books help with this.

You are a different person than you were when you first started that relationship, change happens with time. Now that you are a different person it's probably hard to be comfortable with that. Self exploration is now needed to find that comfort.

My lil' sis didn't do that. She got out of a bad relationship and promptly got into another relationship. This guy is a good guy, married with children, but I don't think she is a strong individual... bends to his will a lot.

Anyway, good luck.

devilmunchkin
17-07-2006, 18:50:22
i think i will have plenty of alone time when he moves out...

ooommm

but how do you know how long is long enough? I swore i'd spend 6 months..but how do i know 6 months is long enough? how do i know if i need more or less?

Japher
17-07-2006, 18:58:34
you'll know...

pretty much, when you stop obsessing about it.

Maybe give yourself 6months minimum, and see where you are then.

Lazarus and the Gimp
17-07-2006, 19:09:57
Originally posted by devilmunchkin

and i just noticed i have a strange bruise in the center of my right palm. odd.



It's probably just the first stages of stigmata.

Gibsie
17-07-2006, 19:51:56
Originally posted by Japher
that's a pretty big "butt"


That's what she said! Oho AMIRITE???

Japher
17-07-2006, 19:55:21
nice...

Greg W
17-07-2006, 20:58:37
Quick post, omw to work...

Everyone's different DM. We all take a different amount of time to get over someone and feel ready to move on. You can't put a time limit on it beforehand, it's just one of those things that happens. Sometimes you know when, sometimes it sneaks up on you, and sometimes you don't think you're ready until you make a conscious decision to get on with things.

mr_G
17-07-2006, 21:12:51
Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp
It's probably just the first stages of stigmata. :lol: now we must call her saint Muffin.

devilmunchkin
17-07-2006, 23:21:51
i like that name! i actually know someone who calls me devilmuffin.

though i do wonder how a sinner like me could have stigmata.

the whole smack! thing is what i'm worried about. It tends to happen fast...the whole SMACK! you're in love again. Like that Bjork song "It's Oh So Quiet"

JM^3
17-07-2006, 23:43:59
Everyone is a sinner.

I haven't been in love in a long time..

JM

JM^3
17-07-2006, 23:59:42
or even in lust... really (I mean, I something that is more then me seeing a girl who is hot)

JM

Greg W
18-07-2006, 01:29:02
DM, about the best advice I can give is to not worry about it. The more you think about it, the worse off you'll be. Sure, take a few weeks to mope around in self pity, but then just get on with things. Don't worry about when your next love is going to come along, and it will happen naturally.

And in that time, learn to like your own company. It takes some getting used to, and it's weird being on your own (trust me, after going out with and then being married to someone for 12 years all up, it was very weird being alone). In the end though, you find that you are stronger than you think. You get used to nobody being there, and start to enjoy quiet moments to yourself, while still being able to look forward to letting someone into your life one day.

And being able to like yourself is like a position of strength - you can then wait for the right person to come along, and not settle for the first opportunity that comes by cos you're desperately lonely. And if you need some company, go out with some friends.

We're all different, but that worked for me. I actually enjoy living on my own now, but still look forward to going out and trying to find someone, without feeling like it's something I desperately need to do.

Greg W
18-07-2006, 01:30:00
Originally posted by mr_G
:lol: now we must call her saint Muffin. S & M? :hmm:

:D

JM^3
18-07-2006, 01:39:47
yeah, but picking at sores is fun

JM

Oerdin
18-07-2006, 03:12:54
DM, you were talking about this in e-mail 4-5 months ago so I am glad you've finally done it. Now it sounds like you need time to rediscover yourself and that means you need to be by yourself. Without a guy you'll actually have to stop and consider what you want instead of spending all of your time filling his wants and needs.

You've gotten into a great master's degree program and you have a perfect chance to rebuild you're life so take advantage of it. I know that won't take away the loneliness or feelings of loss but remember you do have friends in this town. Let me know if you want to go mountain biking in Torrey Pines or something; I find it clears the head and the scenery can't be beat. ;)

JM^3
18-07-2006, 03:38:20
I would also like to suggest heavy ammounts of drinking, while posting on the web.

Jon Miller

Diss
18-07-2006, 08:43:19
I still wonder if love really exists.

Ginfizwithatwist
18-07-2006, 10:27:43
When I came out of a LTR of 5 years, I also had to learn to think as I and not We, I have to say that re-establishing my own single identity was a bit of an uphill battle but I learnt more about myself in the 6-12 months following the break up than I had in all the 5 years before. I began to see me and accept myself for who I was without crtitcism or judgement. I began to have an opinion and voice my feelings and discover who Ginfiz really was as a person. I began to enjoy my own company discovering what i really liked.
DM, you must look at this as a positive time in your life, as a new chapter- sure it will still hurt for a while but you have to consider this: pleasing him and hanging on to him as a friend may be very detrimental to your peace of mind and you have to decide if you wish to remain in limbo , unhappy with your self or if you want to progress and move on - now is the ideal time with moving away and starting afresh at school. This is the time for you to find out and be comfortable with who you really are and you will become a stronger person as a result and this in turn will generate confidence in self.
Sure it is very daunting being on your own but I was on my own before for a long time and really that was ok too, then when the next time for a relationship came around I was able to maintain a sense of self and still be a person in my own right and I think that my relationship was all the better for it.
It may be that for now having him as a friend may not be workable but, in time maybe you may want to re-establish contact if that is also what he wishes ( you may also have moved on in your life and may not wish to re-visit old ground and that is ok too).
Tbh a clean break would probably be better as you will not drag up all those negative feelings associated with him and he with you.
There is a whole world out there full of wonderful people to meet and make friends with and, if somewhere along the line you happen to meet a lovey fella whom you can have a relationship with on an equal footing then all the better!
The time is now to grasp the nettle and shift the axis in your life, and it really isn't so bad on the other side once you have jumped!
Hope things go ok and it looks as though you have a good deal of support here as well.
If he is moving out on the 1st Aug then if you have to house share just don't be around that much, get out and about, see if you can start a short term volunteer thing, visit friends, hang out in coffee shops. That way you won't be around for him to transfer his feelings on to you and re-establish the guilt cycle to make him feel better about himself.
Just take it all a step at a time and a day at a time, it can only get better!

devilmunchkin
18-07-2006, 17:15:23
:) thanks :)

Some days it's bad. I want to run to him and hug him. Other days i'm pro-change. "Yeah! go me! i'm gonna be single! i can do this!" And i look forward to the adventure. I'm not sure why I go back and forth in between. I seem to be a bit stronger than last week. It comes and it goes.

One thing I already predict will be a problem: This learning to like myself bit. I've never liked myself and i've been a life long self-loather. SO i'm not sure how this will work but it's something i already decided to work on.

I've not decided what i will do myself when the apartment is empty. I could hole myself up. I could venture out. I don't know where I would go or what i would do. The hiking thing sounds like a lot of fun actually. i k now i'll need to pack..but that won't fill up enough time... i need to sell the couch. (not moving that. too much $$ to move it. ) Whatever the case, i do have a long journey ahead of me. I'm going to start a self help book my psych prescribed on depression. see if it helps any.

Japher
18-07-2006, 17:22:03
This learning to like myself bit. I've never liked myself and i've been a life long self-loather. SO i'm not sure how this will work but it's something i already decided to work on.


you really defined yourself to much by the relationship

that needs to change more than anything
you are NOT who you know or are dating
you ARE what you do and what you know

devilmunchkin
18-07-2006, 20:59:49
oh no. i disliked me before i ever dated him. BUt i understand about defining myself by it..i let his likes dictate what we did. ALl we ever did was play final fantasy 11.

JM^3
18-07-2006, 21:11:06
Lol, you were a lot of guys dream girlfreind.

I have noticed that some are dominated by their mates interests (even if that isn't their interest or primary interest).

Jon Miller

devilmunchkin
18-07-2006, 21:15:16
i am? why do you say that?

JM^3
18-07-2006, 21:15:59
My freind has a freind who hangs out with his wife and her freinds all the time (when he isn't working). They all don't have full time jobs, and play Sims and WoW all the time, and get together to talk about it.

He isn't a computer person (from how my freind describes him), probably the video games he plays are like Madden and stuff.

I thought it was hilarious, but really it is a bit sad (my freind hates MMOs, but has played some WoW and SWG, and so could talk to his freind's wife's freinds better than his freind).

Jon Miller

JM^3
18-07-2006, 21:17:23
There are a lot of guys who just want to sit arround playing MMOs all the time... girls don't play as much, and those that do aren't generally your age (and as attractive as you appear in your pictures).

Jon Miller
(I have been there, done that, trying to not get addicted again (although I like EVE))

JM^3
18-07-2006, 21:19:59
There is a site that keeps track of MMO players. There are like 5+ times the number of male players, for one thing. Another is that the male distribution is a lot wider than the females, and peaks in the early/mid 20s. The female distribution peaks in the late 30s, and is about nonexistant in the ~20 age.

JM

Fistandantilus
18-07-2006, 21:26:52
Originally posted by JM^3
My freind has a freind who hangs out with his wife and her freinds all the time (when he isn't working). They all don't have full time jobs, and play Sims and WoW all the time, and get together to talk about it.

He isn't a computer person (from how my freind describes him), probably the video games he plays are like Madden and stuff.

I thought it was hilarious, but really it is a bit sad (my freind hates MMOs, but has played some WoW and SWG, and so could talk to his freind's wife's freinds better than his freind).

Jon Miller

What the hell is a freind? Don't tell me is another 'cute', neologism you created to confuse us non mothertongue :mad:

devilmunchkin
18-07-2006, 21:27:56
this is true. on ffxi there are a TON more males than females. And if a female plays, she most likely plays with her boyfriend (unless she's a JP girl. PLaying games in Japan is actually considered cool). ANd if other mmo players find out you are a single female, they'll swarm you.