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King_Ghidra
07-12-2005, 13:06:31
http://film.guardian.co.uk/features/featurepages/0,4120,1657048,00.html

Very amusing too.

F is also for Free Narnia. In the film, the White Witch asks the imprisoned Tumnus if he knows why he has been arrested. 'Because I believe in a Free Narnia!' he shouts defiantly, adding a parable of political revolt (see War). Although perhaps the allegory of a suffering people liberated from a totalitarian regime through the toppling of a monomaniacal dictator by a Christian lion is not one we want to applaud unambiguously at this time.

S is for Susan

The elder sister, Susan, does not have much of a part in The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe. Lucy's actions begin the adventure; Edmund introduces the conflict; Peter resolves it. What is Susan for? She is a cautionary tale: in The Last Battle we find out that Susan has become interested in 'nylons, lipsticks and invitations' - metonyms for sex - and is no longer a friend of Narnia. She committed the sin of growing up. S is also for spanking, one of Lewis's hobbies before his conversion

Funko
07-12-2005, 13:18:12
that is quite good.

Is this a deliberate or a grauniad?

The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch and the Wardroom opens Thursday.

:lol:

Venom
07-12-2005, 13:37:09
Oh no! Not potential Christian subtext!!!!!!!!! RUN FOR THE HILLS!!!!

novacane
07-12-2005, 13:46:57
The film looks awful.

Funko
07-12-2005, 13:49:13
It got an excellent review in the guardian and they are reasonablly respectable.

http://film.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/Critic_Review/Guardian_Film_of_the_week/0,4267,1655499,00.html

King_Ghidra
07-12-2005, 13:54:03
yeah i hear good reviews so far, but remember, novacane is one of those people who just doesn't like fantasy/sci fi stuff so he doesn't care if it's actually any good or not he just doesn't like the idea of it

poor lad, no place for silly dreams in the north, just a life down the pit and wishing your bother hadn't killed your kestrel

Funko
07-12-2005, 13:56:18
Not even Star Wars?

MattHiggs
07-12-2005, 14:54:07
Originally posted by King_Ghidra
yeah i hear good reviews so far, but remember, novacane is one of those people who just doesn't like fantasy/sci fi stuff so he doesn't care if it's actually any good or not he just doesn't like the idea of it

poor lad, no place for silly dreams in the north, just a life down the pit and wishing your bother hadn't killed your kestrel

On the other hand: God damn southern fairies living in their fantasy worlds and bleeching their anuses (is anus latin? would it be Ani?)

Funko
07-12-2005, 14:58:09
Just because we don't need to work 16 hours a day to earn enough food to survive and have some free time..

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 15:18:30
Originally posted by Venom
Oh no! Not potential Christian subtext!!!!!!!!! RUN FOR THE HILLS!!!!

No potential subtext, blatant Christian crusading.

Tolkein aparantly converted Lewis to christianity during a night of drinking and pipe smoking. He later said he had crated a monster. Philip Pulman once said Narnia was the most poisenous thing he'd ever read....lukcily most children will be too young to understand the themes of christian might, betrayal and guilt. etc. etc.

I for one might file it alongside the "Temptation of Christ in what not to watch.

novacane
07-12-2005, 15:21:09
My opinion was based on clips shown on Film 2005. I thought it looked incredibly amateur, not much better than a drama school production. I say drama school rather than school to give it a little credibility.

While we're all familiar with more common subjects of fantasy for grown men, such as sexual deviance, it continues to surprise and confuse me that leaping into wardrobes in search of secret lands where lions talk would be considered to be an attractive premise.

Being able to comprehend these secret magical kingdoms and the weird and wonderful creatures which reside there, is not a sign of an elite mindset as is so often intimated by those who possess it/haven't grown out of it.

Funko
07-12-2005, 15:26:14
is not a sign of an elite mindset as is so often intimated by those who possess it/haven't grown out of it.

I don't think I've ever seen that intimation myself. Fantasy/Sci Fi is seen as totally nerdy with very little redeeming literary value. It's a struggle to convince anyone that any sci fi/fantasy has any literary worth because a lot of it doesn't. (edit: much the same problem faced by any genre fiction)

novacane
07-12-2005, 15:34:21
I have suffered accusations of narrow-mindedness for not enjoying works of fantasy or fiction from many people. Thats usually the basis of the counter argument.

i.e.
You don't understand it

You have no imagination

Funko
07-12-2005, 15:37:57
Do they think insulting you is going to make you suddenly see the error of your ways and agree with them?

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 15:39:14
That would be very narrow minded of them.

Funko
07-12-2005, 15:40:37
On the contrary. I think extremely unlikely that he'd change his mind based on that response so they must be incredibly imaginative people to be able to envision it!

novacane
07-12-2005, 15:43:07
The debate just descends into insults. Both parties guilty really. :cute:

I've been involved in debates about fantasy and fiction with friends (and non-friends) since my school days.

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 15:43:39
No, I'd say they were stupid. There is a big habbit here (especially amongst those who frequent the music and film fora) to insult people when they express a contary opinion. Said people often are the first to point it out when the same is done to them.

Funko
07-12-2005, 15:46:44
You are totally wrong you cunt.

novacane
07-12-2005, 15:47:52
Yeah, I'm aware of that. Personally, thats a type of debate I enjoy. I'm not particularly precious about anything I like and can take any critiscism on its behalf because ultimately, what a non-believer thinks doesn't matter. There's very little point in expressing a negative opinion on something. Its just fun sometimes.

This kicked off becuase I said the film looked awful. That was just my opinion, not a shallow insult.

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 15:49:27
Yeah, but immediately you were dealt an (albeit funny) insult for that opinion. That is what I hate most about this place sometimes, I mean someone has to be pretty insecure about their world view if a dissenter must be ridiculed straight away.

Funko
07-12-2005, 15:53:40
Ah but novacane/K_G have that kind of bantering relationship. novacane gives as good as he gets. I wasn't insulting in my response?

MattHiggs
07-12-2005, 15:54:28
Originally posted by Funko
Just because we don't need to work 16 hours a day to earn enough food to survive and have some free time..

You work 8 hours and then commute 8 hours and then listen to Chas and Dave.

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 15:54:36
No, you're alright :)

novacane
07-12-2005, 15:57:22
Originally posted by Funko
Ah but novacane/K_G have that kind of bantering relationship. novacane gives as good as he gets. I wasn't insulting in my response?

Yeah, thats what I was gonna say. But, I see Nills' point. Would be interesting to see how a completely new poster with no CG connections would be received if he/she said a similar thing.

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 16:02:09
Yeah, it's just a trait of some peole to do the hostile response to a difference opinion.

Eyes peeled for the next time!

King_Ghidra
07-12-2005, 16:16:51
yes i was just taking the piss out of novacane, he's an adult (barely) and quite free to like/dislike what films or genres he likes and certainly doesn't need my approval either way. (and knowing how much he likes kes, i couldn't think of a better film that is more stylistically different from the likes of Narnia)

i know fantasy and sci-fi are nerdy and i'm not familiar with the idea that appreciating it is an intellectual pursuit per se, though it is in the mind of the idiot to reject those things that are unusual

for my part i don't like people who dislike genre things purely on that basis. i don't think the genre has been made, be it film, fiction, music, whatever, that has not produced something of merit. i think everything should be judged on its individual merits and not dismissed purely on the basis of belonging to a genre

however i would acknowledge that some works are so genre-aligned that they invite being dismissed without being experienced, on the basis that they will provide only the same experience one has already had (i'd put hollywood romantic comedies in this class). still, not good to shout one's mouth off about such things

anyway, all that aside, nikhil, you're quite right, ridiculing someone you're having an argument with (as oposed to addressing their arguments) is clearly the lowest form of debate. i'm sometimes drawn to it when people's massive stupidity frustrates me, but i think for the most part i do the right thing and argue about actual points.

amusingly, many people on here seem to think that arguing at all is a bad thing, viz. novacane finding it baffling that funko and me would argue about honda (without insults!)

unfortunately, until i do find one of those magic wardrobes i'm stuck here doing boring earth shit like arguing with retards on the internet

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 16:18:21
Damn that would make a good film!

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 16:21:45
also may I add, that someone else's stupidity is also (for the most part) in the eye of the beholder...and a lot of facitious comments are made purely as reaction to some one elses assumption about their particular stance.

The moral of this story has to be rise above the reactionary / emotive responses as far as possible.

Here endeth the lesson. :)

Funko
07-12-2005, 16:40:11
Originally posted by Nills Lagerbaak
also may I add, that someone else's stupidity is also (for the most part) in the eye of the beholder...and a lot of facitious comments are made purely as reaction to some one elses assumption about their particular stance.

True!

Also body language etc. is non existent on the internet and it can be hard to see things that are meant as lighthearted if you don't know the poster (or even if you do sometimes!)

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 16:56:54
Fuck the internet :). It really is a sad state of afairs when arguing over the internet is preferable to ......well anything!

If intelectual wrangling could somehow be quantified in energy terms, I think the contents of CG could solve our energy needs!

novacane
07-12-2005, 16:58:05
kes, i couldn't think of a better film that is more stylistically different from the likes of Narnia)

Presentation is a key factor for me. Kes encapsulates everything I like. Star Wars (the bits I have seen) encapsulates everything else. Though I can see the appeal.

it is in the mind of the idiot to reject those things that are unusual

Is that another blow to free speech? I don't reject fantasy because I find it unusual. I find it mind-numbing. Familiarising myself with imaginary worlds, tribes, forces, creatures seems like a waste of time. When can I call upon that knowledge? My attention is much better held by things which actually educate me.

ridiculing someone you're having an argument with (as oposed to addressing their arguments) is clearly the lowest form of debate.

Lets not start ranking forms of debate. It never worked for humour. There's a time and a place for any kind of debate and neither should be sneered at. They can all be fun if nobody gets too precious.

many people on here seem to think that arguing at all is a bad thing, viz. novacane finding it baffling that funko and me would argue about honda (without insults!)

I was more impressed.

novacane
07-12-2005, 17:00:10
And lets keep the debating quickfire. This essay form debating sucks the life out of it. ;)

Funko
07-12-2005, 17:06:05
I think it's an interesting comment you made that you'd rather be doing something that educated you

I find the fiction of any genre is educational whether it be emotionally or philosophically or just contains some facts within it. That can range from the most assinine suggestion that, say, a cyanide poisoning leaves a lingering smell of almonds from a cheap detective story to some great emotional insight in a situation you'll never experience. You can get historical perspectives by reading fiction from different eras and seeing their views on things....

I think fiction's highly educational, and that goes for fantasy/sci-fi as well although the meatier the literature the easier it is to make that argument.

Easy to defend some of the novels in the 'changed your life' thread, harder to defent the educational value of a series of Star Wars novels. :)

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 17:10:21
Agreed, additionally I think enjoyment of the shear escapism of fiction can also lead to people taking themselves less seriously and coming across as less pretentious, sometimes. This is a very good thing in my book

Funko
07-12-2005, 17:11:58
Yeah. Certainly I also appreciate fiction/sci-fi/fantasy in a purely escapist enjoyable form as well.

novacane
07-12-2005, 17:15:30
I understand what you're saying and completely agree that there are educational elements to fiction. Personally though, I would rather that information was presented to me in the context of reality.

I also fail to believe how a work of fiction can better portray anything emotional than real life itself. It doesn't have to be me who has the experiences either. Reading about real stories, real life tragedies, moments of great happiness surely do more justice to the emotions involved than a work of fiction. Fiction plays at that kind of thing but it can never be a substitute.

novacane
07-12-2005, 17:17:57
The escapism thing is spot on. I can understand the appeal of fiction for that reason.

But, I hardly think whether you're a fan of fiction or not can have a impact on your pretentiousness. As a rule.

Its almost prententious to say that isn't it?

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 17:20:07
Take a real life, emotionally challeging, educational situation. Someone then has to know about it, and write it well for you to learn from it.

Fiction is a way of bypassing that problem if you have a good writer. Often the process of abstracting it will make it more meaningful to more people.

Nills Lagerbaak
07-12-2005, 17:22:06
Originally posted by novacane
The escapism thing is spot on. I can understand the appeal of fiction for that reason.

But, I hardly think whether you're a fan of fiction or not can have a impact on your pretentiousness. As a rule.

Its almost prententious to say that isn't it?

Well, I used to say anyone who has tried acid / dope is OK, then I realised there are plenty of wankers who do it all the time.
Now I would probably say I don't trust anyone who hasn't tried some kind of mind altering drug.
I expect my opinion will change again...

Point is, it doesn't make one less pretentious, but it helps.

novacane
07-12-2005, 17:24:14
Originally posted by Nills Lagerbaak
Take a real life, emotionally challeging, educational situation. Someone then has to know about it, and write it well for you to learn from it.

Fiction is a way of bypassing that problem if you have a good writer. Often the process of abstracting it will make it more meaningful to more people.

Only if its not from the original source. Nowadays, people are all over the TV, telling their own stories of tragedy and jubilation. I don't need a writer to turn that into a diluted/exaggerated story. Real life stories are plentiful enough now to substitute any need I have for (half-)fictitious accounts.

Funko
07-12-2005, 17:25:45
I'm not sure where this pretentious thing came from?

People are pretentious if they pretend to be interested in something (say literature or whatever) to impress other people.

A lot of people seem to get labeled pretentious for being into intellectual things which is a bit unfair if they are genuinely interested in them?

Anyway, I don't really understand what Nills' point is here.

Funko
07-12-2005, 17:26:50
Originally posted by novacane
Only if its not from the original source. Nowadays, people are all over the TV telling their own stories of tragedy and jubilation. I don't need a writer to turn that into a diluted/exaggerated story. Real life stories are plentiful enough now to substitute any need I have for (half-)fictitious accounts.

It's funny I can't stand that 'people all over the TV telling their own stories of tragedy' you get on TV with the extremely manipulative editing and all that goes with it but I really appreciate a well worked bit of fiction on similar themes.

novacane
07-12-2005, 17:28:15
Yeah, yeah. I know we have to treat factual accounts with suspicion, but to me, they are still of more value than a work of fiction. Lets not go there today. Its getting late.

The Norks
07-12-2005, 18:33:44
Originally posted by King_Ghidra
yeah i hear good reviews so far, but remember, novacane is one of those people who just doesn't like fantasy/sci fi stuff so he doesn't care if it's actually any good or not he just doesn't like the idea of it

poor lad, no place for silly dreams in the north, just a life down the pit and wishing your bother hadn't killed your kestrel

Sometimes I love K_G.

Have stolen that for my sig :)

DaShi
08-12-2005, 06:45:27
Originally posted by Nills Lagerbaak
Yeah, but immediately you were dealt an (albeit funny) insult for that opinion. That is what I hate most about this place sometimes, I mean someone has to be pretty insecure about their world view if a dissenter must be ridiculed straight away.

Well, that's stupid!

maroule
08-12-2005, 09:00:28
we said : no more talks of Republicans



Sc Fi/heroic fantasy in France is definitly as un-pretentious as you can find. I was ridiculed countless of times in the 80s' for reading about 'sword and dragons' or 'laser beams' (didn't help my pick up efforts at all). It had no credibility whatsoever. Imagine my shock upon arriving in the UK and finding massive scfi sections in bookstores! (taht's also when I discovered only the best was translated, and a large part of it was really shitty). The situation has changed now, and even the shit is translated :)

Interestingly, ScFi/HF was seen as a purely 'anglo-saxon' genre (and to a large extend, it is) that lacked intellectual clout. It is still catalogued as 'teenager' litterature, but since teenagers are growing up, the genre is more ambitious, and new french authors have emerged, some of them truly excellent, like Pierre Bordage. 'Pretentious' in France would only apply in reading high brow philosophical essay (like when I was trying to understand the very opaque Emmanuel Levinas to impress girls - a strategy also bound to fail).

The value is ScFi is of course escapism, but in good authors, it's also about understanding the present (because they extrapolate on today's situation and offer a magnifying glass to look at today's trends). In major authors, it can offer a paradigm shift, and totally change your views on some subjects, because the 'exotic' setting offers new ways to look at society, human relations, etc.

Of course, good authors, whatever the setting, will produce good books. Jack Vance 'Cugel Saga' is so picaresque it could have be written by Cervantes, and Dune is akin to a greek tragedy (which was probably Herbert's intention anyway).

King_Ghidra
08-12-2005, 09:37:08
as far as novacane's education v escapism argument

i think it's terrible bullshit

what is education in this context? learning something real or something true? fiction can teach truths. truths about human nature, about society, about ideas. 1984 is a work of fiction, one set in a completely make-believe world and yet one in which many people here think changed their life.

the tragedy of real life as described by real people is that they are typically completely unable to describe it in such a way as to make it seem real. real life is stupid, scared, emotional, unintelligent and animal. novacane calls the work of fiction the diluted or exaggerated version, but that is a nonsense, fiction is the observer that looks down on real life and tries to make sense of it, the interpreter that shows us something like real life and tells us why it is significant

otherwise would the best educated of all be the man who sits at home and watches bbc 24 all day? no thank you, real experiences are nothing more than ugly pictures without some element of interpretation or context.

fiction isn't a substitute for real experiences it is a complement to them. fiction is nothing without the reality of our own experiences, and our own experiences (as valid in their own right as they are) can be richer for the existence of fiction

Debaser
08-12-2005, 09:49:43
I think he just meant he prefered his fiction in a context he can properly relate too, eg he like Kes 'cos he can relate to Northern grimness and whippets and shit like that.

Nills Lagerbaak
08-12-2005, 10:13:23
Aye, Get ta fook Novacane!

novacane
08-12-2005, 10:13:50
OK. This is ganging up now. :cry:

I've enjoyed hearing everybody's views and have learned a little about the appeal of fantasy.

I didn't have an education vs escapism argument :confused: I wasn't formulating any argument. I was simply reacting to the posts which make me out to be a leper for not enjoying works of outlandish fantasy. I thought the film looked amateur. Thats all.

I have begun to read 1984 this week. I don't dismiss all types of fiction. IMO, 1984 is pretty incomparable to something like Narnia.

As for you K_G, plenty, but this is rubbish.

real experiences are nothing more than ugly pictures without some element of interpretation or context

So you can't interpret them yourself then? And context isn't supplied by other knowledge and experiences of your own? K_G - Your particular argument is full of holes and exaggerations but I feel this whole thing is going round in circles.

King_Ghidra
08-12-2005, 10:39:28
no it wasn't my intention to imply that

i don't think my argument is full of holes at all, all i'm saying is that experience and real life is one thing and great in it's own way, but that fiction can provide a different perspective or angle on real life, even though it is itself unreal

novacane
08-12-2005, 10:43:26
Then we agree. :bounce:

Funko
08-12-2005, 10:44:35
The discussion on how much 'reality' you actually get from non-fiction or tv news for example is a different issue but I think it's a blurred line between 'fact' and 'fiction' when you are dealing with any media.

King_Ghidra
08-12-2005, 10:49:59
Originally posted by novacane
Then we agree. :bounce:

you think we do? i thought you'd just spent the entire thread railing against unreal fiction...

novacane
08-12-2005, 10:50:22
Originally posted by Funko
The discussion on how much 'reality' you actually get from non-fiction or tv news for example is a different issue but I think it's a blurred line between 'fact' and 'fiction' when you are dealing with any media.

Yep, we learned that at school ;)

Funko
08-12-2005, 11:07:13
I am older than you, we didn't have mickey mouse courses like media studies back then.

novacane
08-12-2005, 11:14:06
Originally posted by King_Ghidra
you think we do? i thought you'd just spent the entire thread railing against unreal fiction...

Yeah, I agree about the merits of fiction. The world would be a poorer place without it.

The only source of disagreement here is that personally I prefer the symbolism often depicted by fiction to be presented in a different way. Identifying symbolisms within works of fiction is highly satisfying but it could be argued that the subtlety of this method only complicates the issues it addresses, sometimes unneccessarily so IMO. These issues can be learned about via many other sources. Also, the question of trusting factual accounts can equally apply to works of fiction. Who's to know the motives of the author/ creator. You can't trust anybody to be "on the level"

But, I can't question the merits of fiction or fantasy when its clear that many others better appreciate the form.

novacane
08-12-2005, 12:56:38
Originally posted by The Norks
Sometimes I love K_G.

Have stolen that for my sig :)

:o :rolleyes:

King_Ghidra
08-12-2005, 13:00:02
bah i only just realised the typo on brother :mad:

though norks could have a least put K_G and not this K-G fellow

novacane
08-12-2005, 13:22:32
The opening bit, the "K-G on novacane" bit.

Is this more fantasy?

Funko
08-12-2005, 13:23:02
Gramercy's going to get jealous.

Or will you guys let him join in?

novacane
08-12-2005, 13:56:02
You sound particularly interested.

Kitsuki
08-12-2005, 13:57:41
Originally posted by Nills Lagerbaak
No potential subtext, blatant Christian crusading.

Tolkein aparantly converted Lewis to christianity during a night of drinking and pipe smoking. He later said he had crated a monster. Philip Pulman once said Narnia was the most poisenous thing he'd ever read....lukcily most children will be too young to understand the themes of christian might, betrayal and guilt. etc. etc.

I for one might file it alongside the "Temptation of Christ in what not to watch.

Although I fear the world may come to an end for me agreeing with Mills - I couldnt agree more with this.

And boy are Disney doing their best to cash in on a Christian market. Was also amazed to hear that there will be absolutely no blood, depsite the battle scenes, in the film. Imagine what LotR would have been like without gore....

Nills Lagerbaak
08-12-2005, 14:04:14
That's why they say (like temptation of christ) it's going to bomb here.

Funko
08-12-2005, 14:16:38
Disney/Kids movie. No surprise.

MattHiggs
08-12-2005, 14:32:32
K_G - King of the Sigs.

Fergus & The Brazen Car
10-12-2005, 09:58:41
Originally posted by Kitsuki


And boy are Disney doing their best to cash in on a Christian market. Was also amazed to hear that there will be absolutely no blood, depsite the battle scenes, in the film. Imagine what LotR would have been like without gore....


Disney are also apparently 'updating' Winnie the Pooh... no, he doesn't become Winnie Diddy in da Hood, but gets a FEMALE friend, just so all those impressionable widdy kiddy winkies don't think Winnie was going to get a civil ceremony any time soon with his same sex cross species chum, Christopher Robin.

It's the Battle of Pooh Corner. Seven years after Disney acquired the rights to Winnie the Pooh from AA Milne's former club, The Garrick, it stands accused of betraying his literary legacy.

Next year, Disney will release a new series called My Friends Tigger and Pooh, from which Christopher Robin, far right - who was named after Milne's own son - has been erased.

Instead, in a bid to appeal to a more modern audience, Disney has decided to replace the character of Robin with a six-year-old girl. She is supposed to share various "character traits" with Pooh and Tigger.



http://news.independent.co.uk/people/pandora/article331916.ece

Fucking ghastly.

Love to see their Bible update- Lot's wife doesn't turn into salt, but in a merchandising deal with Chef Boyardee, she metamorphoses into an attractive condiment set, including specially matured balsamic vinegar from Holy Land Cedar of Lebanon casks, Dead Sea salt and Hot as Gehenna! pepper.

DaShi
10-12-2005, 17:54:47
No, it's just be the Bible without the gore. How will that be any good?

MOBIUS
12-12-2005, 17:47:59
Saw this yesterday.

Wish I'd known it was by Disney, cos then I'd have boycotted it till it came out on TV...

I don't know where everyone is getting all this excessive christianity from, because all I saw was a moralistic tale of a triumph of good over evil.

I had to remind myself it was a kid's film, which also led to my main criticism of the seeming tacit approval of the use of child soldiers - I'm sure Charles Taylor would heartily approve!

Anyway, great CGi and quite entertaining in its warlike childish way...

7/10

I hope my obvious massive stupidity and excessive use of smilies in this thread hasn't frustrated K_G, cos I'm not sure if I could take another tirade of his insults so soon after the last time...:cry:

Japher
12-12-2005, 18:48:44
read the book

mr.G
13-12-2005, 10:11:51
Originally posted by MOBIUS
Saw this yesterday.

Wish I'd known it was by Disney, cos then I'd have boycotted it till it came out on TV...

I don't know where everyone is getting all this excessive christianity from, because all I saw was a moralistic tale of a triumph of good over evil.

I had to remind myself it was a kid's film, which also led to my main criticism of the seeming tacit approval of the use of child soldiers - I'm sure Charles Taylor would heartily approve!

Anyway, great CGi and quite entertaining in its warlike childish way...

7/10

I hope my obvious massive stupidity and excessive use of smilies in this thread hasn't frustrated K_G, cos I'm not sure if I could take another tirade of his insults so soon after the last time...:cry: where your two friends with you?

Kitsuki
13-12-2005, 10:24:10
I think in the light of Winniethepoohgate and Narniagate we should take stock of what Dr Hibbert said -

Hibbert: Well, only one in two million people has what we call the "evil gene". Hitler had it, Walt Disney had it, and Freddy Quimby has it.

maroule
13-12-2005, 13:53:06
Originally posted by Fergus & The Brazen Car


Love to see their Bible update- Lot's wife doesn't turn into salt, but in a merchandising deal with Chef Boyardee, she metamorphoses into an attractive condiment set, including specially matured balsamic vinegar from Holy Land Cedar of Lebanon casks, Dead Sea salt and Hot as Gehenna! pepper.


:lol: