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Asher
18-04-2005, 19:09:42
Well, at least your salaries went up this year...

http://money.cnn.com/2005/04/15/pf/college/starting_salaries/degree_worth3.gif

http://money.cnn.com/2005/04/15/pf/college/starting_salaries/index.htm?cnn=yes

Martini
18-04-2005, 19:15:01
What on earth classifies as 'liberal arts' anyway?

DevilsH@lo
18-04-2005, 19:16:10
english, art history etc

JM^3
18-04-2005, 19:17:05
classics is sort of the epitome of liberal arts

but I bet that philosophy and english and all that was included...

Jon Miller

Martini
18-04-2005, 19:18:23
So....what are non liberal arts?

JM^3
18-04-2005, 19:20:10
engineering
business
etc

JM

Martini
18-04-2005, 19:24:05
Ok. I think I've got it now. So what do they classify the non liberal arts as?

JM^3
18-04-2005, 19:26:10
well, some fall under the list of sciences..

Jon Miller

Asher
18-04-2005, 19:26:27
See the chart.

Asher
18-04-2005, 19:26:51
Liberal Arts
Sciences
Applied Sciences

protein
18-04-2005, 19:28:40
Would poetry about how wonderful neo-conservatism is fall under liberal arts?

Asher
18-04-2005, 19:31:14
Yes.

Martini
18-04-2005, 19:32:18
I still can't understand why they call them liberal, rather than just 'arts'.

Is this only in America, or does the UK do this too?

Christoph
18-04-2005, 19:34:59
\o/

I'm going to be an apperentice for computer engineering. Looks like it pays well in the US, should be quite a bit in the UK.

Lazarus and the Gimp
18-04-2005, 19:41:05
So is law a liberal art?

Martini
18-04-2005, 19:42:19
Only in certain places ;)

Asher
18-04-2005, 19:44:28
Originally posted by Christoph
\o/

I'm going to be an apperentice for computer engineering. Looks like it pays well in the US, should be quite a bit in the UK.
What the hell is an apprentice for computer engineering?

Laz: Law is a graduate degree, these are undergrad degrees. Law students frequently take the Liberal Arts degrees as undergrad degrees for the easy marks and high GPA to get into law school.

The lawyers who study a science or applied science then go into law are rare, and extraordinarily highly paid for that.

Christoph
18-04-2005, 19:49:24
Apprentice is a little person learning the trade first hand, and you get paid for it too.

Asher
18-04-2005, 19:51:28
Is this a 4-year degree?

protein
18-04-2005, 20:00:39
Originally posted by Christoph
Apprentice is a little person learning the trade first hand, and you get paid for it too.

Asher
18-04-2005, 20:08:30
In that case, these numbers mean nothing to you.

Lazarus and the Gimp
18-04-2005, 20:16:26
Law is an undergraduate degree in Britain.

Asher
18-04-2005, 20:20:13
You can get a law degree in 4 years in Britain?

It takes about 8 here.

Low standards?

Lazarus and the Gimp
18-04-2005, 20:21:52
No. After the degree there's the one year Legal Practice course. Then the two years of Articles.

Asher
18-04-2005, 20:23:39
The point is this is a comparison of 4-year bachelor's degrees, of which Lawyers are obviously not part of.

Lazarus and the Gimp
18-04-2005, 20:27:15
Blimey. I was only curious.

Gibsie
18-04-2005, 20:36:18
and that is why you suck

Cruddy
18-04-2005, 22:10:08
Originally posted by Asher
You can get a law degree in 4 years in Britain?

It takes about 8 here.

Low standards?

Law covers a wide variety of employment and skill requirements. As I understand it, there is (from my point of view); civil law; criminal law (both in my country) and international law (which is every other set of laws and circumstances, other countries laws and how 2 or more sets of laws clash; to cover things like piracy on the high seas, wars, trade etc).

People working for law firms are not the only people making money from the law(s). Things like intellectual properties, the people who own them, politicians, diplomats, spies...

All of those have some understanding and training in the law, or have benefited from it. Or in other cases found it a liability. :sleep:

HelloKitty
18-04-2005, 22:29:03
In Britain you can get a medical degree in 6 years.

Here it takes a minumum of 8.

DevilsH@lo
18-04-2005, 22:32:24
Originally posted by HelloKitty
In Britain you can get a medical degree in 6 years.

Here it takes a minumum of 8.

Its our natural superiority- we learn complex and taxing subjects much more quickly than Americans and Canadians.

HelloKitty
18-04-2005, 22:38:47
Yep, wonder how people feel about the knowledge of their doctors about basic science and its impact on thier practice.

I would look up some old AH posts but am too lazy.

Cruddy
18-04-2005, 22:41:41
Originally posted by HelloKitty
In Britain you can get a medical degree in 6 years.

Here it takes a minumum of 8.

I suppose that means you're not in Britain -I'm a bit slow tonight. Hold that thought and forget about one crounty's standards and another's.

... look at those 2 professions - they're not even on the list. Medical and Legal. Nor a few of the professions on my list, for some of which a degree is not uncommon.

And which can earn your more money.

HelloKitty
18-04-2005, 22:44:14
Originally posted by Cruddy
I suppose that means you're not in Britain -I'm a bit slow tonight. Hold that thought and forget about one crounty's standards and another's.

... look at those 2 professions - they're not even on the list. Medical and Legal. Nor a few of the professions on my list, for some of which a degree is not uncommon.

And which can earn your more money.

What does that have to do with my post?

DevilsH@lo
18-04-2005, 22:47:02
Originally posted by HelloKitty
Yep, wonder how people feel about the knowledge of their doctors about basic science and its impact on thier practice.

I would look up some old AH posts but am too lazy.

ah you bite so easily :)

Lazarus and the Gimp
18-04-2005, 22:49:25
Originally posted by HelloKitty
In Britain you can get a medical degree in 6 years.

Here it takes a minumum of 8.

Well you yanks are always a bit slow to start things, like jobs, world wars and stuff.

Cruddy
18-04-2005, 22:51:15
Originally posted by HelloKitty
What does that have to do with my post?

It means I didn't know you didn't come from Britain.

It also means that Asher's list is incomplete, or maybe Liberal Arts is a catchall for something that didn't fit neatly into the others because those professions are few and highly paid.

And that if what we're talking about is a list of average annual earnings for degree holders, that doesn't mean much against what you individually as a person will earn after you qualify.

HelloKitty
18-04-2005, 22:53:10
Stop it, you are getting Poly all over this thread.

Darkstar
18-04-2005, 22:53:59
EWWWWWWWWWWW!

Now we have to go wash our computers. Thanks so much! :mad:

JM^3
19-04-2005, 01:46:18
here Cruddy, it is discussed adnasuem here

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=132332&pagenumber=5

JM

Oerdin
19-04-2005, 02:38:53
It doesn't list salaries for the sciences.

Asher
19-04-2005, 02:46:24
There are no salaries for the sciences at a bachelor's level.

JM^3
19-04-2005, 02:50:52
or we get engineering type jobs...

JM

Oerdin
19-04-2005, 02:52:36
Originally posted by Asher
There are no salaries for the sciences at a bachelor's level.

Starting salaries for Geologists with B.Sc degrees is around $40k-$45k while chemists and biologists also make good money with just B.Sc degrees.

Asher
19-04-2005, 02:52:58
Tell that to Rich.

JM^3
19-04-2005, 02:53:27
he is in the UK

JM

Beta1
19-04-2005, 09:33:10
plenty of graduate level jobs in pharma over here. They are always looking for graduate chemists, esp for process type jobs. Lots of places for people with medicinal chemistry degrees. Theres fewer grad biology jobs unless you have done some lab work, although its not uncommon to see graduate positions in microbiology.

With the current exchange rate graduate chem/bio jobs in the UK making $40-$50K are not unheard of. Hell, I got paid around $30K per year on my PhD.

Dyl Ulenspiegel
19-04-2005, 09:43:48
Originally posted by Asher
You can get a law degree in 4 years in Britain?

It takes about 8 here.

Low standards?

Law does not require an undergrad study here, too. General education is done in highschool. Highschool grads enter law school for a 4 year master study, followed by a 2 year professional doctorate.

However, most professions require a further 4 years of training on the job. Admission to the bar exam, for example, requires Master + 9 months court practice + 18 Months attorney practice.

Funko
19-04-2005, 09:55:01
Originally posted by HelloKitty
In Britain you can get a medical degree in 6 years.

Here it takes a minumum of 8.

So you are a full two years behind us after high school? I knew you were behind but... wow.

Dyl Ulenspiegel
19-04-2005, 09:58:27
3-4 years rather, for the undergrad degree. But they catch up by leaving out some essential medical stuff.

Beta1
19-04-2005, 10:58:53
:lol:

Funko
19-04-2005, 11:22:03
I still don't know why it's "liberal arts" not just arts.

Dyl Ulenspiegel
19-04-2005, 11:28:07
At the risk of phding, the artes liberales were the classical canon of education with roman roots, transmitted by the church and adopted by early universities. Graduating from the arts faculty was the precondition for going to the law, medicine or theology faculties. (That is at least one model)

The name comes from being the proper basic education for a free man.

Funko
19-04-2005, 11:29:06
Ah right. We've just lazily dropped the liberal then...

Funko
19-04-2005, 11:29:30
I'm surprised they still use that word though, I thought it meant "spawn of satan" in the US.

Dyl Ulenspiegel
19-04-2005, 11:31:06
Well, dropping the "liberal" is justified IMO because the 7 artes were:

grammar - rhetoric - philosophy
arithmetics - geometry - music - astronomy

Some of those made it into the sciences; actually, the old arts or philosophy faculties have been split into arts and sciences.

Funko
19-04-2005, 11:33:38
That makes sense. :)

LoD
19-04-2005, 12:17:17
Originally posted by Funko
I'm surprised they still use that word though, I thought it meant "spawn of satan" in the US.

:lol:

Freedom arts?

Provost Harrison
19-04-2005, 12:18:59
Originally posted by Asher
Tell that to Rich.

That's funny, last time I checked my income came out at about $75k a year...things have moved on a lot since I was in Hull...I may have got paid sh*t at my last job, but my God was it leverage...

Funko
19-04-2005, 12:20:51
Originally posted by Asher
There are no salaries for the sciences at a bachelor's level.

:lol:
Crap troll.