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Asher
23-06-2004, 02:16:02
I bought a replacement 9800 Pro for $290 the other day.

That Radeon 9800 Pro I bought for $290...is even a better deal than I thought. I was installing my massive quiet video cooler today when I cleaned off the thermal paste from the chip, and it read "R360"(!). The R350 is the 9800 Pro, R360 is the 9800 XT (faster and newer). It turns out Saphire (the company who made this board) has been using R360s instead of R350s for months, due to the 350s not being made anymore and being in huge demand. Not ONLY this, but the PC board and RAM are identical to the faster 9800 XT cousin. In short, this is a 9800XT, just with a custom BIOS to pretend to be a Pro. I looked around on google, and found an upgrade -- now I've got a 9800 XT for $290! Hah. 9800XTs are $650CDN (from NCIX).

The Mad Monk
23-06-2004, 04:12:27
So I should put a 9800 Pro on my shopping list, then?

Asher
23-06-2004, 04:13:15
Only some can do it. :)

Sapphires are a good bet. The ATI ones will never do it.

The Mad Monk
23-06-2004, 08:33:32
Okay, I take it this is the card in question?

http://www.vr-zone.com/reviews/Sapphire/9800Pro/box-small.jpg

It also has the ATI logo on it -- am I looking for one without an ATI logo?

zmama
23-06-2004, 13:22:18
No, you want the logo

The Mad Monk
23-06-2004, 14:43:33
Just not as the..."headliner"?

zmama
23-06-2004, 14:45:29
Right

Asher
23-06-2004, 14:46:53
That's the exact card, yes.

Zopperoni
23-06-2004, 14:52:42
How do you remove the stock HSF from the videocard? I took a look the other day, and mine's kind of... stuck.

I have a Radeon 9500, and I'm considering getting the Zalman cooler, but I'll need to know how to remove the stock cooling first...

MDA
23-06-2004, 16:12:59
I thought the Sapphire Atlantis was the 128 (not 256)-bit one that they got into trouble for.

Asher
23-06-2004, 17:25:56
Originally posted by MDA
I thought the Sapphire Atlantis was the 128 (not 256)-bit one that they got into trouble for.
Hmm? Mine's a 256-bit one...

How do you remove the stock HSF from the videocard? I took a look the other day, and mine's kind of... stuck.

I have a Radeon 9500, and I'm considering getting the Zalman cooler, but I'll need to know how to remove the stock cooling first...
It depends on the card, it's really easy.

On most ATI cards (newer ones at least), there are 2 things at the back holding it on, and you use pliers to pinch the sides together, then it can be pushed out of the hole.

On my card, I needed to use pliers to pull out black plastic 'nail', then pushed it out from the back.

MDA
23-06-2004, 17:39:43
http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20040618_063138.html

You should be OK, the 128-bit one was labelled, just misleading because it was a PRO card.

They had the nerve to apologize yet continue to call it PRO, too. Funny stuff. :)

The Mad Monk
23-06-2004, 18:17:13
Sapphire is moving to alleviate said confusion by renaming the 128-bit version to the SAPPHIRE RADEON 9800 ATLANTIS

...so I should the Sapphire Radeon 9800 Pro with the ATI logo but without the Atlantis style?

The Mad Monk
23-06-2004, 18:19:47
...except of course that Asher says that's the exact card, which means he got the 128 bit Atlantis, but it has the advanced chip, which probably couldn't use the 128 bit interface and...

I'm confused. :(

Asher
23-06-2004, 18:38:27
No no no. Atlantis PRO one is 256-bit. The non-pro one is 128-bit. Look at that quote carefully. :)

The box you've shown is the exact card I have. 256-bit, 9800XT rebadged as a 9800 Pro.

MDA
23-06-2004, 18:44:44
The 128-bit card (edit: WAS) called an Atlantis PRO, but the box will have a sticker added that says "128-bit" - just check to see you're getting the 256-bit one for sure, becasue Sapphire (edit: WAS) calling both cards "PRO".

edit: I wouldn't expect any problems, now.

No longer Trippin
24-06-2004, 02:05:23
MDA saved me the explanation. Most Pro's are shipping with R360 cores now which isn't necessarily a good thing. SOME of these cores are BINNED to be only Pro's and not XT's. If you can't overclock it to XT speeds without the bios flash (BBA's are 'locked' now) then it won't do it with it. Now if it is just an excess chip that just was binned for Pro usage just on numbers, then you'll get thermal monitoring and a few extra mhz out of the memory as the timings are relaxed slightly from what I've read. I'm running an R350 core at 453 but haven't done the flash, and those who have haven't gained any megahertz (other than if they left it at stock, then you'd gain 32 on the core). Hopefully you've gotten an excess one instead of a delibrately binned one.

Not spending balls to the wall this time? You could have picked up an X800 or a 6800 if you could find them in stock. :)

The Mad Monk
24-06-2004, 07:57:20
I just discovered I can't afford the card. :(

What's a good cheap one?

Sir Penguin
24-06-2004, 08:06:15
The Radeon 9600. You could get an OEM one for under US$100.

SP

The Mad Monk
24-06-2004, 08:12:10
Okay, I'll start looking at those, thanks.

Asher
24-06-2004, 14:14:34
Originally posted by No longer Trippin
MDA saved me the explanation. Most Pro's are shipping with R360 cores now which isn't necessarily a good thing. SOME of these cores are BINNED to be only Pro's and not XT's. If you can't overclock it to XT speeds without the bios flash (BBA's are 'locked' now) then it won't do it with it. Now if it is just an excess chip that just was binned for Pro usage just on numbers, then you'll get thermal monitoring and a few extra mhz out of the memory as the timings are relaxed slightly from what I've read. I'm running an R350 core at 453 but haven't done the flash, and those who have haven't gained any megahertz (other than if they left it at stock, then you'd gain 32 on the core). Hopefully you've gotten an excess one instead of a delibrately binned one.

Not spending balls to the wall this time? You could have picked up an X800 or a 6800 if you could find them in stock. :)
No one had them in stock, I tried.

My old R350 hit 486MHz before artifacting. That's with the Zalman VGA cooler w/ AS-5 though.

Haven't tried the R360 yet. But the whole point of the 360 was to redesign it to clock higher, so we'll see.

No longer Trippin
27-06-2004, 06:32:58
My core ran without a heatsink for several minutes (all the way into windows clocked at 445) before locking. Long story. Now I need water now to get it back to that speed and have to run it at 325 core with the stock cooler without artifacting now. Still, most people lose cores within getting into windows, so I'm VERY lucky.

486? That's very impressive with water much less the Zalman which isn't the best of coolers for the 9800. Averages with good cooling are around 440. I got lucky with a core, and was lucky to have it survive (saved me money) and seems you had gotten lucky on a core as well, just lost it in the end. The R360 has been found to clock just like the R350 did. Your looking at more of a new stepping than a truly redesigned core. Even the 9700 is very close architecturally to the 9800. So expect the same results you'd have with a Pro. 440 is the most common wall even with the R360 core, some manage to go higher, some don't. It's luck of the draw as usual.

Zopperoni
05-07-2004, 17:18:54
Originally posted by Asher
It depends on the card, it's really easy.

On most ATI cards (newer ones at least), there are 2 things at the back holding it on, and you use pliers to pinch the sides together, then it can be pushed out of the hole.

On my card, I needed to use pliers to pull out black plastic 'nail', then pushed it out from the back.
Thanks man, it worked :)