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Darkstar
15-07-2003, 15:07:47
Master of Magic is being hosted at:

http://www.dragonsword.com/magic/

Docs, patches, you name it.

It's abandonware. Meaning you cannot buy the game, and noone has told them to take it down. :D

Get it while you can...

MDA
15-07-2003, 17:32:31
Cool, never played it, and I've never seen it for sale anywhere.

Qaj the Fuzzy Love Worm
15-07-2003, 19:36:57
Rumor has it that's what ZAngband's magic system was insipred by...

MDA
16-07-2003, 12:18:51
I need 1704 bytes of memory!!!

Running with VDMS.

I tried playing around with the conventional memory, but no dice.

Won't run without VDMS, autoexex and config files are set up like they're supposed to be in the FAQ.

WinXP

Qaj the Fuzzy Love Worm
16-07-2003, 16:37:25
Get a dual boot system. I did, and I can play almost all my old stuff. Notable exceptions are Privateer 2, and XCom: Apocalypse craps out ("Can't communicate with VGA system" or something).

Everything else runs, if a little fast in some cases, fine. How's that for butchered grammar?

MDA
16-07-2003, 16:49:09
Dual boot system? So I'd need to install some version of DOS and make a boot disk?

Greg W
17-07-2003, 02:56:21
Not sure if that's an own goal attempt or just a fundamental misunderstanding of how dual boot systems work...

Dual booting just means having 2 OSs on your PC, where you can boot to either. Not too hard to do, normally just install Win95/98 first, then install XP or whatever, and do not select to upgrade, select a separate installation.

MDA
17-07-2003, 13:35:47
No, I'm really that dumb sometimes. Just didn't understand the acutal definition.

So I'm guessing it just pauses and asks which OS you want to load during a boot. The last time I did something like that, I needed a DOS boot disk with a homemade autoexec and config?. Many. Years. Ago. -When there was actual MS-DOS in Windows.

Anyhow I got the 1.7k of memory I needed by running without sound.

Qaj the Fuzzy Love Worm
17-07-2003, 16:16:09
Yeah, but with Dual Boot you could maybe have sound, possibly. I'd have to try it myself and report back to you. I remember getting Star Control 2 working once.

The Dual Boot systems you can make these days will install a multi-booting master boot sector on your computer, if you install it in the same order outlined above by Greg. And yes, it pauses for a set amount of seconds (mine's 900!) until you choose which O/S you want to boot, and it'll boot into that.

MDA
17-07-2003, 18:42:27
Well, the only copy of Dos I ever had was 6.22 (I think) and it was on 5 1/4" floppies. Its long gone.

I'm not ever sure I have Win95 any longer.

Played only a bit - I can see now that Age of Wonders took a lot from MoM.

Darkstar
17-07-2003, 22:29:05
Age of Wonders had wanted to be MoM2.

StarDock is working on what they term "MoM2" (called Elemental right now).

I've got some other little tricks to try out, to see if I can get a full featured MoM running, with sound, on a single boot XP system. I'll report my results here, eventually, if successful.

MDA
18-07-2003, 16:53:43
That would be great!

I'm usually a "follow what I read on the internet" person when it comes to getting DOS games running- otherwise its trial and error, which sometimes works, but its time-consuming.

Koshko
19-07-2003, 06:11:01
Awesome ... This was one of the best games ever. :)

MDA
21-07-2003, 16:16:09
Holy hell, how long does one of these games last?

You can customize land mass, but not overall map size. Smaller map sizes might make for games that could be finished in an evening. Long games is an old, common problem in
TBS, though. Guess I should have expected it.

Darkstar
22-07-2003, 04:44:53
MDA... with some experience, you can totally kick but in MoM, and play it all out in one to two days. Helps to know what you want your main strategy to be when you build/pick your wizard and race... :)

But fun is fun. Why worry about rushing? Did you rush your other TBS games?

Qaj the Fuzzy Love Worm
22-07-2003, 15:18:16
Why are long games a problem?

When MoO3 was being designed, I was an advocate for making the map size restricted only by whatever resources existed on your PC. The idea was shot down by people who didn't want to play hugely long games, but why limit it for people who do - no-one's forcing you to play giant 6 month campaigns. I still think this should be put into more games.

Of course, with that comes the tools to prevent micromanagement and tedium, and the industry has been unable to put a lot of that kind of thing into practice, so maybe game programmers have to start doing a better job with in-game mechanics before they can cater to us masochists.

Darkstar
23-07-2003, 02:33:21
Long games are problems for remembering what you were doing.

Master Of Magic suffers from double length games, compared to most World Conquest Games (particular the Civs of its time), because it has 2 worlds to conquer on it. And at least one wizard is guaranteed to have the stronger magic world to himself, unless you pick to start there with him.

MoSe
25-07-2003, 11:36:53
Wow, a MoM thread here too!

till now I was looking from time to time in Poly's MoM Forum...

One of my all-time favorites.

DS, 2 worlds to conquer but only (up to) 4 opponents to defeat...
Of course, if you let Sss'ra cast Planar Seal...

One of its recognised flaws was indeed the dragging endgame.
I could count on one hand the games that I've actually finished, but I deeply enjoy starting countless thereof and bringing them up to a clear winning (...or losing) point.

I barely played AoWs, but when I suggested the filiation I was loudly objected that they resembled *much* more to the HoMMs (non of which I have played yet)...

The Civ side of MoM was rather simplified at the time (no ZoCs, no workers placement inside basewindow, FIXED 4-tiles minimum base spacing, buildings not depending on "research" but merely on a construction hyerarchy...).
The complexity was introduced with the unit detailed stats and variety, and with the spell system.

What I loved, TBS diehard as I was and am, was the TACTICAL TB combat too!
And the customisation of your wizard which influenced your whole playing style, which was not common to find in those days (at least with the games I knew...).

As for the configuration, I found excruciating to mess with Win98 pifs and config files to free those few missing base memory bytes (and at that time that was my main working occupation too!).
I much simpler opted to make a true DOS bootable partition on my system, with PowerQuest PartitionMagic/BootMagic.
I still have it, expressly to run MoM and Machiavelli without fusses and problems.

MDA
25-07-2003, 16:27:01
I've found that your picks at the beginning of the game direct the strategy you *must* use to win, unless you play at difficulty levels where the AI can't keep up. Also beginning to catch on to which spells are worthless and which are vital.

The AI is becoming annoyingly proficient at bringing down my gryphons? with web spells. Sly bastard. I was chewing his navy to bits before they could land troops then he caught on and started using web and slugging it out; or web, call lightning; web, wrack, deathspell. Nothing quite as fun as watching your webbed immobile gryphon take five minutes to die from
call lightning because you boosted his resistance with bless. The little fools on their galleys just sat back and watched the show.
I can see the parallels with HOMM3 (the only one I've played) as well as AoW. They've got multiple levels/worlds, tactical combat, heroes, cities, varied units, spells.

Has anyone tried AoW2?

Darkstar
25-07-2003, 20:59:47
AoW was disappointing to me, in the sense that it hyped itself as a "MoM" 2, but turned out to be just a HoMM with a homage to MoM via its magic system.

The reason MoM did not require research to get the advanced buildings was simple... it already had a research system to get more spells. And the magic and heroes were the real focus of the game, not the units. Ah, the times I had a single hero capable of taking out stacks of those Blue Dragons... :)

TAZ
27-07-2003, 09:26:02
Downloaded it but not got round to installing.

MDA
28-07-2003, 16:30:57
The AI tends to let its stacks get split up when moving - often moving 4 groups of two through an area instead of keeping a killer stack of 8. Makes it easy to conquer if they've already done the dividing for you.

Cities are another matter... takes more planning and buff spells.